Good quote from a movie: "free speech is not free. There are consequences to your actions" or maybe it went like "free speech is not free, you must pay for everything you say" i can't really remember.
Which is true, ya you can go and print a story about how Hitler was a good leader even though his cause was fucked up. But you will get backlash from everyone that doesn't support that.this is just an example not saying i support it
I am not following the whole discussion but just a comment on this. Medicating children for simple behaviors that just requires educating and teaching is outright barbaric. And it is a huge mistake BUT, that being said so is corporal punishment. It does jack shit and many times it has the opposite effect. There are many ways to discipline children and be very strict and teach them responsibility without resorting to physical violence and it is more effective and ethical if done right.
The point is not teach children (that later will be adults) to be disciplined out of fear of pain but to teach them to be responsible for their actions. The later cannot be done using physical punishment.
As very well mentioned before there is a reason why such aggressive and violent behaviors are very easily seen online. Because communicating through online means decouples the action from its consequences. There is a great segment where Louis C.K. gives a great example with mobile phones.
All kids begin cruel because of their lack of sufficient social interaction. We are very much programmed to understand other people feelings through reaction. This understanding is an instinctive reaction. When we do something aggressive to someone face to face, we understand his sadness or fear or annoyance. Whether we act upon this understanding and stop it or continue has largely to do with our views and principles, but at least we understand that we hurt the other person.
Online you do not even get to that point. You are instinctively oblivious of the other persons feelings so you act on the aggressive impulses without any kind of feedback from the other person as he is not really there. In that situation you can only consciously decide that what you are doing is wrong and for this to happen for a child someone must teach it to him. I doubt that most parents would punish and even check a kid for bad behavior online, even though they would punish them for the same behavior elsewhere. That is the main cause imo. And if you grow up with having the majority of your social experience online instead of offline you never learn to respect other people as you never had to truly see what the consequences of your behavior actually were.
You can not apply one type of consequences to everyone it will not work. But I think you me and blanger are all on the same page that it is the lack of some form of consequences that is the whole problem. There is no repercussions at all, and kids are getting online younger and younger before they even know what is right and wrong ways to talk to someone.
I do agree with you, I'd only add that sometimes it requires more than talking in a stern voice to actually get the child's attention and moving mentally in the correct direction, and kids are different what works for one may not work for another even in the same family but once they are on the correct path fear can be removed for other motivators as long as consequences remain in place.
The thing is in the US we are at an all time high (excuse the pun) of using medication to fix behavior problems.
Same lack of consequences applies to those actions themselves. Nothing is going to happen over insults on the internet. And it's both kids and adults who engage in this behavior.
That mostly aren't even problems. Kids are bored during extremely boring classes taught by incompetent teachers? Who would have thought. On top of that, vast majority of parents really suck at parenting.
I want to kind of expand on @turin231 post again but in a different direction, which is the Fear aspect.
It's surprising to see that Fear isn't listed as a human emotion (when you google the topic), but a whole range of things like Boredom, Confusion, Horror, Hunger are listed which seems really weird to me, but this definition seems to fit my point.
"Fear
is a vital response to physical and emotional dangerâif we didn't feel it, we couldn't protect ourselves from legitimate threats. But often we fear situations that are far from life-or-death, and thus hang back for no good reason. Traumas or bad experiences can trigger a fear response within us that is hard to quell. Yet exposing ourselves to our personal demons is the best way to move past them."
The thing is Fear is a necessary motivator in life, be it fear of loosing something like your house for not making the payments, or fear of death because of unhealthy habits like smoking, fear is a human emotion that is one of the greatest motivators to do the right things in life, Fear is what keeps you from doing stupid things like driving too fast when road conditions are dangerous, or cheating on your girlfriend/wife, in some cases fear of eternal damnation is what motivates people to be rightest and attend church, and fear is one of the prime motivators in adolescent life whether it's fear of being caught skipping school or fear of flunking a test by not studying.
We can not remove fear as a human emotion because it plays a huge role in early development of our thought processes when determining right from wrong, fear is a character builder same as compassion is, fear keeps us out of trouble while teaching us respect for laws and the physical limits of our human body, fear keeps use from doing stupid things because it is a teacher also, I'd bet fear has at almost every point in most of our lives keep us doing the right thing and progressing as human beings.
Have you every witnessed a small child that wonders off from their parents? have you seen the fear in that child's face as the tears fall? , have you seen the joy also when reunited with it's parents?.
Instilling fear in a child may seen at times to be cruel but the harsh reality is that life is cruel and it's better to be proactive and teach your child about fear and how to cope and avoid it because the world will be much less forgiving than a parent will be, and the life lessons the world will teach will be harsh and uncaring.
I am not talking about fear in abstract way. It is a very useful reaction in many respects (and very misleading in others). I am talking about Fear of physical/physiological pain which I think criminal imo for any kind of teaching or discipline process...
I do understand your point of view and that view point is shared by many in the field of psychology, unfortunately when it comes to fear physiological, psychological pain are often a byproduct of the process that is unavoidable, it really makes no difference if it's physical pain from falling off a bike or emotional pain from watching your dog get run over, fear and pain are inevitable and try as you may you can not shield humans from either.
You encounter authoritarians, narcissists, psychopaths, sadists, sociopaths⌠in the real world without the aid of modern technologies. Learn to avoid or ignore them whenever possible.
What do you mean by racism? From my perspective people overusing word "racism". I'm often use the N word in work with friends and in my mind, but we just fooling around, yet there is no black people in my country so no one to ofend there. I see myself as a racist, but I never offend black ppl anywere as it is inpolite, even in online gaming. The bigger problem in online gaming is nationalism, I remember this from playing Lineage II, polish and russian ppl lights up there like nationalists and they are serious, not fooling around. Ignorance and refusal to use international language are realy high.
Corporal punishment is not an inevitable force of nature. You can not inflicted it if you chose not to and use other discipline methods ...
While this is an interesting discussion it is a wee off topic maybe a new thread for it?
This is a experience I know about all too well.
When I was around 17 years old, I went through a period of hatred. I would frequently insult people online with racial slurs, among other things, despite growing up with a very anti-racist upbringing. My thoughts at the time were "I'm not racist - I hate everyone." In retrospect, it was because I hated myself. I didn't feel I had value, so I didn't value others. I felt powerless, so I attempted to exude power through vitriol.
There were many factors that played into that time in my life. Growing up, I was constantly reminded of how much I was a money-sponge, a dead weight, one more problem to contend with day to day, paycheck to paycheck. I was taught not to take anything I had for granted, which by itself is not a bad thing to instill in a child. But my upbringing went a step further: I was made to feel that I would never be able take care of myself. I was kept from getting a job, getting a drivers license, going to college, getting my GED. If I moved out, I would be a drug addict, I would live in filth, I would starve. I could be anything I wanted to be - but only with my parents support, on their terms.
That frame of mind eventually gave way to my current psychological afflictions (ASPD and NPD), and my phase of hatred was when those disorders began to take shape. Although that period of my life left its mark, I of course recovered from that ignorance and prejudice that ate away at me on the inside. For me, the most cathartic change I made was of my perception of value. In the universe - a chaotic maelstrom of destruction and creation - I can find no inherent value in anything. Nothing we do makes a difference to the grand scheme of things. You must provide your own value, instead of relying on others to ascribe it to you. I felt the racism, sexism, homophobia, xenophobia, and all other lugubrious concepts melt away as I found value in myself, and thus had no need to devalue others to feel valuable.
There are many reasons people turn to this sort of aggression. Some for the same reasons I did, some because they actually feel they are a superior mammal to others, and some for reasons totally unclear to even themselves. Regardless of why, I pity those who have it, because I know first hand how pitiful that existence is.
[edited for typos]
Well said. And congrats on your self awareness journey. I was emancipated at 15 years old and left on the streets of NY where I found people of all races and creeds looking out for each other. I think the cure is loving yourself, compassion for others, and being exposed to good people.
Commonality has nothing to do with what is acceptable or unacceptable. If it did, we would still have slavery in the United States.
Did you read the original post? If racism is pushing him to not game online anymore, it is a non-sequitur to think it is not an issue.
You're a part of the problem if you think there is no problem.
But at what point should we accommodate to another's feelings?
In regards to racism?
When you verbally or physically abuse them.
No at what point does a person have to mind what they say to avoid being called a racist? Since many things now are considered racist.