Info & advice needed on my alt server rig design

as an alt to my amd/truenas/pop-os server rig design

would a Custom Dell Precision T5810 Workstation work an be able to power an run all this alt server rig design - Radeon RX 6400 - PCPartPicker

or would i need to up the psu watt an if so would this FT7T6 825W For Dell Precison T5810 T7810 T7610 T7910 Power Supply D825EF-02 - 365PowerSupply.com - Replacement Laptop Power Adapters,Desktop Power Supply & Server Workstation PSU.

work an be enough


2 reason for my alternative server rig concept is 1 the pci lane diff as the e5-2650 v4 has 40 lanes vs both the 2 amd cpu’s both just being 20 which i would think benefit my desired layout

an 2 the amd an desired mobo max ram of 128gb an the dell’s having the option of 512gb which if it can power an handle my stated an desired loadout i really want the 512gb option so i

can dedicate to the main os (truenas) 128gb’s & pop-os in VM 64gb’s an each of the android vm’s 32gb’s for a total config 128+64+32+32

an between having the 2 x internal 12tb hard drives id like to run same as i would with the AMD build 2 x SABRENT USB 3.2 4 Bay 3.5" SATA Hard Drive Tray Less Docking Station (DS-SC4B

each with 4 x of the same drive which id like to run the 2 x internal 12tb’s & each of the DS-SC4B in raid 10 an iv heard the truenas core

while running zfs needs a lot of run as in 1gb of ram per 1gb or tb of storage so with a combined total storage of 120tb or 60tb depending

on how that factors when running in raid 10 i figure with truenas an the vm’s an all that storage the 256gb to 512gb of ram would be helpful.

so any thoughts or advice an info on all this would help.

On server, it all depends on how many cores and RAM you have available, these days.

Seriously though, it seems like you are trying too hard to fit a Ryzen CPU into a enterprise setup. Don’t. At some point it is better to just bite the bullet and go EPYC / Xeon. Also, don’t forget the golden rule of enterprise; you don’t go custom unless you have to, because the cost of maintenance will usually be significantly higher than what Dell, HP or other brands charge.

If all of the above is for a home rig, you’re about to massively overspend for a Watt-hungry monster that will be turned off half the time due to the electricity bill. For home, you want to downsize.

Giving advice here is very difficult though since you do not tell us what your use case here is. If it is a regular NAS… A single Ryzen 7600 can easily do NAS duty, if you want HW encoding a Radeon 7600 can do that but a 6400 is missing a lot of HW codecs.

So I’d try to go with a AM5 system, Ryzen 7600 + RX 7600, and scale back on RAM to something like 32-64 GB. But that’s only for a pure NAS.

The old advice of ZFS requiring 1 GB of RAM for every 1TB was true ten years ago, but now it’s more like 1GB per 10 TB due to both changes in efficiency and changes in how ZFS works today.

How many drives total do you run? CPUs more than 4 years old are sooo much slower than modern counterparts it’s…it’s hard to recommend anything that old for any task. Modern cpus manage power so much better too.

Unless it’s basically free id probably not bother with anything older than Skylake for server.

I have a dual socket Naples server I just retired I feel bad about not using…but it’s kinda slow. A 32 core tr3000 desktop CPU runs 3 circles around it.

for my amd build do you think the stated apu will be able to handle 64 to 128gb of ram an the stated add-on cards on that mobo an 10 of those 12tb drives in raid 10 with the os’s an vm’s or would a 5700g be better

Again, what are you trying to build?

A NAS?
A Server?
A combined all-in-one machine?
Are we talking hundreds of services, or just a few?
Are we talking hundreds of users, or just a few?
Is this a productivity machine, or a home / lab machine?

Sounds like you are too locked in to a particular solution and I interpret this is supposed to be a home or small office server, mostly NAS but will run a few services off of it. I could be wrong. With this in mind I would today just go directly for an AM5 build or Intel Core i5 non-F build - they have built in integrated graphics which completely obsolete the need for a GPU unless you want to do GPUey stuff like encoding and bitcoin mining.

So, I’d go for something like a Ryzen 7600, 7700 or 7900, or an Intel 13400 or 13600k.

As for a motherboard that supports a lot of HDDs, how about this build? I am now assuming a home NAS with perhaps one or two small services thrown in for good measure. I want to stress that this is an example, feel free to change out parts in whichever way you’d like. I have not included a chassi or PSU, nor have I bothered with ECC in this particular case. If this is important to you, feel free to continue the discussion, this is a baseline. :slight_smile:

NAS 12 disk home server core

Type Item Price
CPU AMD Ryzen 5 7600 $219.99
Motherboard MSI MPG B650 CARBON WIFI $289.99
Memory Corsair Vengeance 2x32 GB DDR5-6400 CL32 $214.99
Storage Samsung 980 Pro 250 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 $36.99
Wired Network Adapter TP-Link TX401 10 Gb/s $99.99
Custom Trotwei Blue M.2 to SATA 6-Port RAID Card $49.90
Total $911.85

As for your original question, the 5000 series are no longer a good server recommendation IMO, as the CPUs either lack integrated graphics or do not support nice-to-haves like ECC. With the 7000 series, you don’t have as many tradeoffs, and the cost difference is now not significant enough to matter.

its to be a NAS? / media Server / direct to storage blu-ray disk rip ( vi 2 x external blu-ray drives ) an compress / combo os machine? with truenas as base os with pop os in vm to run

handbrake & makemkv & drmare m4v-converter either in a win10vm of in bottles vi pop for my itunes tv files

"Are we talking hundreds of users, or just a few? " just 5 total 2 vi desktop pc 2 vi laptop 1 vi NVIDIA shield

“Is this a productivity machine, or a home / lab machine?” id say maybe a combo bit of that

primarily that overall intended purpose is to have it handle all the stated task rather then bogging down my main rigs an for performance i dont need licked y split but maybe just
take an hr or 3 if im batch ripping / compressing an converting files an other content

i wanted to have the direct to storage blu-ray batch ripping / compressing an converting of files
go to the 2 x SK Hynix Gold P31 1 TB on the Sonnet M.2 2x4 Low-profile PCIe Card the if if could be automated

in the app of handbrake to compress an convert the rips on them an then transfer to
the Seagate Exos X14 12 TB drives an then delete the original files from the nvme’s to keep them unclogged

the other nvmes on the mobo would be for the os an vm’s

im not sure if this would be less comber-sum but could this more condensed setup work

a Minisforum UM560XT with a SK Hynix Platinum P41 1 TB (icepc M.2 Heatsink ) for os’s an vm’s

ram - TEAMGROUP Elite 64 GB (2 x 32 GB)

Crucial MX500 2 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive for direct to storage blu-ray batch ripping / compressing an converting of files

an 2 x SABRENT (DS-SC4B) each with 4 x Seagate Exos X14 12 TB Drives each in raid 10

an would i still get the 10gb connection with 2 of these
Right Angle USB 3.0 USB-A male to USB-C female Adapters

unless you can point me to some USB 3.2 Gen2 Type-A to USB 3.2 Gen2 Type-C cables

would either of these work for that

I am working on a video where I use a simple cheap USB disk enclosure with a minipc and it works surprisingly well. With zfs you don’t run raid in the USB enclosure it’s just jbod so cheaper.

Some usb5gbps don’t pass through smart which is bad. Some do though. What I’m testing now. also USB is a bottleneck unless it’s truly 10gbps USB but for media serving tasks that’s not a huge deal IMHO.

G series 5000 series apus have cut down pcie functionality. For a while I ran a 5800x in itx with an aic 16 drive hba. No GPU at all… Used the GPU to setup truenas got it on the network then swapped the VGA for the hba and it still worked. This was better than a g series apu IMHO. No need for an APu if your motherboard won’t error out on novga. Some don’t like not having vga…

could you explain that again i didnt really get that ,is the mini + sabent + exos drives good or bad

im still a simple noob :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: :crazy_face: i dont always easily follow wendell speak

Allright, so giving this some thoughts, my recommendation is the following setup for something that can live in a media center in your living room. The TLDR; Get one NAS box, one small server box and then whatever your daily is for the desk.

This is all done by one single machine. 12 Bay NAS will be tricky, most do 8 and you can get cheap cases that support up to 11 drives, but higher is tricky.

How much storage do you really need though? I estimate one losslessly compressed 4kBD image to take up 20GB or so, that means 1TB can house roughly 50 movies. After that it is a linear progression, here are some rough figures on how many movies you can expect to store for each combination:

Drive Size 12 x JBOD 12 x RAID5 12 x RAID6 8 x JBOD 8 x RAID5 8 x RAID6
12TB 7 200 6 600 6 000 4 800 4 200 3 600
14TB 8 400 7 700 7 000 5 600 4 900 4 200
16TB 9 600 8 800 8 000 6 400 5 600 4 800
18TB 10 800 9 900 9 000 7 200 6 300 5 400
20TB 12 000 11 000 10 000 8 000 7 000 6 000
22TB 13 200 12 100 11 000 8 800 7 700 6 600

So, unless you expect to have more than 5 000 titles ripped before 2030, the 8 drive solution should be more than enough for your needs today, and for tomorrow, well, HDDs are going to die out soon with products like these.

However, that makes sense around 2030, not today. Today, I recommend this:

NAS 10 disk home server

Notes and rationale

The AM5 platform will be a viable platform for another 3-5 years, and it is quite possible that a 35W TDP 4-core or 6 core chip comes along that allows you to free your 7600 to one of your kids, siblings, or partner. It also allows flexibility upwards, in case your future needs require more. 32 GB of RAM is plenty for ZFS. Long gone are the days where 1 GB per 1 TB was a requirement, and now 32 GB in a NAS is almost overkill, given how basic the functionality now is. Ryzen 5 7600 is simply overkill for what you want it to do, but is the by far cheapest CPU for now.

The case is mATX with support for 10 3.5" drives. While I agree this is not 12 drives, going bigger is just going to invite more headaches and costs - Then we’re talking rackmounts etc. Even 10 drives is stretching the realm of possibilties here.

The video card provided is not strictly necessary, but if you plan on a media server it is pretty much the cheapest option that provides HW encoders for all current popular media codecs. You could save $70 and buy a decent 6600 for $199, too, but doesn’t really feel worth it at this point.

The PSU is, frankly, way overkill but was the cheapest I could find with 10 SATA power connectors from a decent brand.

Rest is about as bog standard as it gets. I think the Node 804 is passable in the living room cabinet, of course YMMV. Note that I have not included HDDs, buy as many or few 16 TB ones as you can afford right now. Dollars per TB is the key metric here.

Here I am still a bit unsure. Do you mean Workstation virtualisation, or server virtualisation? You should not do workstation virtualisation on a server, server is more for stuff like Dockers.

I will assume you want a home server with virtualisation options, and for that, I think I have just the thing:

Virtualisation Server

Notes and rationale

Virtualisation means many cores are desirable, server means low power is highly desirable, especially in the home. The Ryzen 9 7900 does both.

I do not have much to say about the RAM or motherboard, both are chosen for their price and quality of the components.

Two 1TB drives are chosen for if you want to RAID0 them and go BRRRR. With a NAS on-premises and since the server is not critical, backups need to be made frequently, but otherwise this machine should have no reliable storage, it should be treated as a permanent cache system with a disposable OS. Should the server go down, it goes down. Oh well. No big loss if it is out for a few hours.

Where this really shines is with the Chopin case, really. Another one of those living-room friendly cases, you will be able to keep this one in plain sight just next to your NAS.

Alternatives? Nope, even the Intel Core i3 12100 draws too much power for the Chopin case and while you could go with the Intel Core i3 13100 for the NAS just fine for $100-$200 less… It doesn’t allow any upgrades. As for AM4, it is just no longer worth the cost savings over AM5 either.

a few questions

1 with RAID6 which till now iv never heard of 2 ? 1 would you prefer it over raid 10 & 2 for 4 x 12tb drives how much usable space would have as i dont quite understand the chart


why does 8 x jbod seem to hold less then 8 x raid 6

2 i vaguely understand why raid 6 is better then 10 an if i get it to loss my data i would have to have more then half die or the whole so that does sould good if im understanding it right , an does running in raid 6

work with zfs an do i have this right that raid 6 on 4 x 12tb drives make i smaller volume like 16tb or 12tb because of the Data striping with double parity if so that ok as iv got spread across a number of external

drives about 8-1/2tb of files ,tunes,pixs, an vids that took about 6years to amass an iv got about 2tb total of 4kbd,bd,an assorted tv box sets an music combined iv yet to rip an backup that took two years to amass

so if raid 6 on 4 x 12tb drives make i smaller volume like 16tb or 12tb that will do me just fine

  1. Workstation virtualization Dockers., or server virtualization? iv got no idea about the diff, what i want to do with this build is this

NAS for all my network devices ,
a media Server (ie to listen to tunes on my pcs an play vids an tunes on my NVIDIA shield vi plex or other)

a direct to nvme storage blu-ray disk rip ( vi 2 x external blu-ray drives with makemkv ) an compress with handbrake an write to the raid 6 array

Workstation virtualization & Dockers or server virtualization? well i guess if handbrake,makemkv an drmare m4v-converter can be installed used as stated vi dockers in the truenas core os as the main an only

os installed without running pop-os in a vm then that
not sure if that falls under workstation vz or server vz

if handbrake,makemkv an drmare m4v-converter can be installed in pop-os as the base os an also have truenas core installed on pop to manage the raid 6 array then that

The chart is how many compressed Bluray movies you can store, at a maximum, using a given setup. So a 12x16TB in RAID6 can store roughly 8 000 4k Bluray images. To get how many TB of raw storage that is, simply divide the number by 50. (8000 divided by fifty is 160 TB of storage, which is, surprise surprise, 10x16TB (+2 parity drives) of usable storage).

As for Raid levels, just read up on it. For this use case I think RAID5 is good enough, and JBOD is borderline if you can get away with it. Depends on your willingness to act a librarian, all RAID requires maintenance. You might find cold storage to be a better fit for you personally.

I don’t see why you would ever want to install Pop! OS as a server. Just install VMware on any machine you use as a desktop/workstation and install Pop! there. If you run Linux or Mac, run qemu instead. That said, Pop! is best experienced with the System76 hardware, just like MacOS is best experienced with Apple hardware. Just because you can run it differently does not mean you should.

That said… Yes. It is a freakin’ NAS, you can also use it to back up virtual machine images.

And yes, you can run compression schemes on the NAS / Media server, and that’s where the Ryzen 7600 shines. You need a bit of work to set it up, but IIRC handbrake allows you to do everything via the command line and if it’s CLI you can script it. That is an entirely different topic though.

To conclude, scrap the Chopin build and go with the 804 build as a NAS/Media server only. It will be able to do everything you want it to do. Wait with the GPU too, until you are sure you will need it.

i didnt really want to run Pop! OS as a server. just to install an run
handbrake,makemkv an drmare m4v-converter

because i could never really understand if an how i could install an run those app in trurnas core an how
i dont know everything about making scripts or doing those app vi command line as im used to an prefer

gui’s interfaces

i figured the truenas would be the base os with pop iv a vm with the stated apps installed ther an have the converted an rip files stored in a common data folder on the tb drives an running pop without the disk

encryption should make contents available to the array on truenas right?

also im i getting this right that for 4 x 8tb drives in raid 6 id get 16tb total usable space

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