This argument is self contradictory.
This isn’t about perfection. It’s about layers to cut through. It’s about addressing vulnerability with obstacles.
As for the appeal to credentials, this makes me wonder if you are capable of understanding not only the point but the strategy as well.
I’ve been watching the information spread and watching scientists with good skills in statistical analysis criticize the available information. It’s been horrible since at least January; where one involved with bioinformatics said that the data was bad, and particularly in the US.
I’ve been watching a scientist who models economies like epidemics criticize the data; in detail, by what is wrong with it. He’s just now starting to get enough data from New York to make heads or tails of what’s going on there.
I saw a tech professional trying to guess with the horrible data about what the mortality rate of the disease was; so he could criticize the lockdowns. His argument was it’s just another Flu like disease. He only has a 25% chance of being right about the mortality rate and another Flu like illness is worse case scenario to begin with. The Black Plague has nothing on Flu when it comes to numbers of deaths.
Right now Japan has 50 deaths; probably because of mask culture. The political issues in the US has poisoned the culture to the point that it can no longer reason about these types of issues. The US should not be in the state it’s in now. Everyone has dropped the ball; myself included.
We need to turn around on this thing. This crisis isn’t a money issue. The supply side and supply chain are still dependent upon human hands. The network of partnerships that composes supply side is so complex that it could cascade from a failure. This could effect necessities. It’s not just about the products that are made. It’s also about maintenance of overhead and brick and mortar. This could get worse than a depression; and please excuse me if I don’t have confidence in our ability to deal with it.
It’s a obvious fact that this isn’t sustainable. Tick tock.
The powers that be already sorted all this out. The situation is going exactly as practiced, surprisingly.
Shitty people will do shitty things. Please don’t get stuck on that. I am using mock-ups to explain the concepts visually which is difficult to write.
More than enough… and it’s not about who but what. Who gives a shit about your background, qualification, status and all that shit when it comes to problem solving…
I am not sure I understand all your questions but later today I’ll try to explain them. Also I added you to long thread where I have explained everything in great details. Did you check that? It would be great help if you be more specific with your questions?
There’s not enough motivation to do so.
I̶ ̶d̶o̶n̶’̶t̶ ̶k̶n̶o̶w̶ ̶w̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶y̶o̶u̶ ̶m̶e̶a̶n̶?̶ ̶W̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶i̶s̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶w̶h̶a̶t̶’̶s̶ ̶n̶o̶t̶ ̶f̶u̶n̶n̶y̶ ̶a̶t̶ ̶a̶l̶l̶?̶?̶ ̶I̶ ̶f̶e̶e̶l̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶i̶t̶’̶s̶ ̶d̶i̶f̶f̶i̶c̶u̶l̶t̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶h̶a̶v̶e̶ ̶a̶ ̶p̶r̶o̶d̶u̶c̶t̶i̶v̶e̶ ̶d̶i̶s̶c̶u̶s̶s̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶ ̶y̶o̶u̶.̶ ̶I̶ ̶s̶u̶g̶g̶e̶s̶t̶ ̶y̶o̶u̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶a̶s̶k̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶r̶e̶l̶e̶v̶a̶n̶t̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶s̶p̶e̶c̶i̶f̶i̶c̶ ̶q̶u̶e̶s̶t̶i̶o̶n̶s̶.̶ ̶I̶ ̶h̶a̶v̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶u̶n̶d̶e̶r̶s̶t̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶q̶u̶e̶s̶t̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶i̶n̶ ̶o̶r̶d̶e̶r̶ ̶a̶n̶s̶w̶e̶r̶.̶.̶
I think I understand what you mean. Nature of solution is like that. SelfAI is just a term I am using for lack of better term. The reason it revolves around this because it’s the core requirement to have a secure 2 way attention protocol. No matter how educated and smart you are. You are constantly manipulated. SelfAI is you greater awareness that uses approach of science and statistics to reason things. This is your technologically charged heuristics. Having an extended awareness for each person is probably the most logical way to achieve this. For this reason, you have to be able to trust your own awareness.
Other way to think about it, we’re all data points and we are part of all kinds of of data-sets that are required to solve problems like COVID 19. In order to represent your data points, you need to participate in simulations from your vantage point, it creates a feedback for you which aids your heuristics, meaning you are validated correctly hence guided correctly. You gotta represent yourself in some safe way and this is one possible way.
Free public health care is the big one.
Mandatory sickness benefits are another
Most first world countries have those.
If you don’t, sick people don’t get tested (can’t afford it, can’t afford time off work), and sick people go to work and infect everybody else.
And the current USA situation is the result.
It is in everybody’s interests that the entire population have access to infectious disease treatment. Everybody! For free!
Including the third world. The last thing we need is Covid19 mutating into something far more nasty due to un-checked, rampant spread and mutation through africa.
People forget, that plenty of first world people travel in and out of third world countries every day (or did prior to the current lockdown on that) and will continue to do so in the future.
Even if one doesn’t care about the third world or poor people (because one is a self centred asshole), it is in one’s own self interest to prevent this happening…
As bad as COVID19 is - it’s a walk in the park vs. how bad things /could/ be in today’s connected world.
We also want to be doing blanket testing.
If you don’t have enough kits, do a random sample. Testing sick people you already know are sick = positive result. Good for you. We already knew they were sick!
What we need to know is what the infection rate is among general population as not all show symptoms. If you can get a statistically significant number tested at least you can infer what you’re fighting.
Given that plenty of people show mild or no symptoms from COVID19 the results in the USA really scare me at the moment. Due to asymptomatic carriers, lack of testing and lag in testing (see first two points) and lag in reporting… i’d hazard a guess there are at least a few million cases there right now.
I resonated with this video, thanks for sharing… the guy at 5:30 is expressing similar ideas and sentiments we are trying to discuss here… I think to solve a lot of things, participation of masses is a must. The only reason we don’t pay attention to lot of common abstractions because we think that some special organization is responsible for that… Guess what, they can’t and don’t do good job… We think that organizations like CRY is taking care of kids but yet kids are dying… Same with climate change and natural disasters etc…
The possible outcomes of this crisis have little to do with how money is spread around. It has to do with how people protect themselves; and others. Most governments in developed countries are not addressing this well. They are just using it to push their agendas.
Social distancing doesn’t cover the moisture in ones’ breath carrying the virus to surfaces. What does that is bi-directional masks; but not things like dust and aerosol respirators. Respirators have a reed valve that allows unfiltered breath to escape. That doesn’t protect others from you.
Here are the possible outcomes by severity:
South East Asia is kicking this things ass because THEY ARE WEARING MASKS! They are protecting themselves and each other. Good healthcare systems are not helping near as much. As a matter of fact, they are being overburdened. The western culture of putting this on the government isn’t helping.
We solve this by changing our behaviors; not by telling inept, incompetent, poorly informed “leaders” what to do. The outcome is likely to become more severe; unless we change our behaviors.
Just an abstract thought…
What if the virus is natures way of solving a problem?
Really a communal approach is the only good solution. Look at china, they have how many billions of people and their infection rate is already plateauing, and less than other countries.
In my mind I am thinking that my mock ups and examples are pretty self explanatory… Sorry if that’s not the case…
If you’ve been following corona pandemic then you must know that areas where infections has spread are high risk zones. If I have knowledge of high risk zones then I would avoid buying my groceries from those zones to lower my probability of contact. I would also avoid highly density areas like market, junctions, stations etc. The map aids to my intuitions with real statistical information.
Data comes from people in the network, depending on type of info, it could be an individual, responders, healthcare workers, epidemiologists or government… But mostly from individuals phone, other gadgets and self reporting etc…
I feel like these questions aren’t even relevant for the scope… but If I have to answer then reliability depends on how is it implemented… and “From whom is it?” Attention network is like Internet. No one owns it. But like ICANN, there’ll be some entity managing the integrity of the network. I dont knw…
Leaking? Contextual information. This implementation would be way more privacy oriented so user does not have to worry. The location data is recorded every few seconds however it’s not being beamed anywhere. The interaction would take place on service level.
For example, COVID 19 has multiple services and one of which is “MapMovement”. this service will request to enter your SelfAI instance bound with list of zones it wants to check, it will map to your movements and send back only matched with list. Essentially it’s just verifying if you have interacted in those zones instead of sending all your movements.
You can apply this with another service for contact tracing called “ContactTrace” with list of contact to check of you crossed path with any.
for starter, they will be more safer. The logic of pandemic is less contact.
Anyways, I appreciate the questions and I will try my best to answer them all. But I please request to not be cynical just because you didn’t understand something. The concepts I’m putting here may be hard to understand and that’s why I’m trying to explain with mock-ups and images…
This is why they are saying to wash your hands - regularly, after touching communal surfaces, etc. Not just after taking a dump.
Masks aren’t a solution because:
If everybody knew how to use them and dispose of them properly and we had plenty of them - sure. But that simply isn’t the reality we live in. We can wish it was, but it isn’t going to make it true. We need to deal with reality.
We need measures that can be easily explained and adopted by children.
South east asia is kicking ass because they started preventative measures early, did blanket testing AND enforced quarantine. That’s far more relevant than simply wearing masks.
The USA is not because trump spent 2 months saying nothing to worry about, a month blaming china (he’s still saying it’s a “chinese virus” despite the USA having > 3x the cases) and claiming it isn’t a problem, and let the virus run rampant through the USA. He assumed closing borders was “job done” but it was too late, the virus was already locally transmitting.
Your lack of public free healthcare and safety nets for employees (sick benefits, etc.) are encouraging spread too.
You guys still hadn’t tested anywhere near as many people as Australia last i heard. Certainly not by head count. NSW here has 8m people and had performed 160k tests as of a few days ago. And we are probably behind where we should be too.
You need to blanket test or at least test random sample to get an idea of spread - because plenty are asymptomatic carriers. Testing people you already know are sick just isn’t enough.
The USA response has been a complete and utter shambles.
I didn’t just make this up; and “no one else is going to do it” is a pretty silly argument. Anything that prevents your spit from being transferred to the world around you will suffice. Any ones’ breath could spread it; and it’s even worse with speech, as tiny droplets are unknowingly ejected.
This is a distributed issue; that could be very well addressed with a distributed measure. It’s an easy thing to do; that could bring about the most positive outcome.
Not sure I understand properly. In my view, everything can be considered natures way. Human ego and behavior in itself is a product of evolution. It’s tied to some motivation like money, influence, power, legacy and shit… Biggest influencers have better hold of outcome they want but the system is too large and complex for any human mind to control or comprehend. This is actually core of the problem because it literally creates hurdles in the progress. COVID 19 situation is result of such egocentric behaviors.
If you compare human body as a colony. There’s are all sorts of organism working and fighting constantly that propagate abstraction that defines your well-being. I’m talking about simple function organisms like cells, bacteria, viruses etc. And if you zoom out and see the collective behavior, we aren’t that far off even though we have way more sophisticated intellect. In fact I can argue that these simple function organisms have more sophistication than us on collective grounds.
My point is, we kinda need to understand the distinction in self and collective is matter of abstraction. We must have a system design that takes care of this distraction for us so we aren’t constantly overwhelmed… So we can achieve a state where we focus on problem solving, reducing risks etc. We can start with making people get rid of their basic struggles with thing like UBI…
I’d like the opposite of this kind of restriction. The problem to me lies in the reaction, or overreaction to be exact. People die every year to many things. Ruining everyone’s life to save a few is silly.
This is not restriction, this is calculated freedom in the case of such crisis. The opposite is the lock-down which is worse and impacts freedom, economy and just about everything else.
I am confused what you mean by opposite? If you think that people should get on with their lives as usual in the middle of pandemic outbreak then you would potentially be ruining everyone’s life.
these are the same thing.
The 5th amendment should be inalienable as a human right.
It should be up to the person if they want to get on with their life or if they want to quarantine.
No… they’re not…
Not when you are infected and asymptomatic and potentially put others lives in danger too.
If you’re infected and not showing then theres really nothing to be done anyway.
I won’t have my rights restricted, especially by an ‘app’.
That’s what this solution is about, even if you are asymptomatic, it calculates probabilities of you contacted with the direct or indirect infected, and suggest personalized actions…
App is just an interface to interact with a larger framework connected in an attention network to provide insights to a platform to simulate scenarios and stop spread…
And thats fine, so long as its optional to use and follow. If it just becomes a method of restriction then its going to fail miserably anyway as people will inevitably lie to do what they want as they already have been irl
