Why didn't you guys critically look at solar road ways?

You guys have talked about solar road ways twice, as if they're a good idea.


I find this extremely disapointing, expecially from you guys who I feel tend to be critical thinkers.


First, the only down side ever mentioned was cost, thanks to wendel. Why didn't you guys talk about how glass is a terrible road surface and is softer than Jello. Why did you guys talk about the issue of power transportation? Why didn't you guys talk about how tiles are just HORRIBLE for a road surface?


Why did you guys just gloss over the entire topic without taking a critical look at it?


I expected better from the tek.

This is what I would have expected you guys would have done.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H901KdXgHs4

They did and this is like the 5th time this video has been posted.

Im so tired of seeing that damn video. Seriously guys? find some new material. And to you morons talking about glass as a road material, you do realize that there are many types of glass right? That some types of glass has a coefficient of friction not so different from concrete? and that if it had a textured pattern it would actually offer just as much grip as a concrete road? Tiles can't be much worse than the patched mess asfault roads I have to drive on to get to my university, and if you don't pay attention to dodge the potholes you will have the front of your truck ripped out from under you. Tiled roads don't have potholes, and if they did they wouldn't get a shitty road patch that sticks up a few inches off the road, no they would just drop in a replacement tile. Power transportation? Logan already said it would be terrible over any kind of distance, and that they would need a whole new localized power grid for it to work, and that it would really only be effective for buildings in the immediate area.

Also, there are already several threads covering this exact topic, stop posting new ones!

Wendell said he didn't think it was realistic in The Tek 116. But I do think the challenges were glossed over in 117 and Logan and Qain did describe it as one of the best ideas ever. If you read these forums frequently you've probably seen these posts against it, but a large portion of the audience is exclusively on youtube. 

But yeah, while solar power is a great idea, building roads out of solar panels when you could stick them almost everywhere else is just dumb. 

Yeah I don't think like solar energy is a bad idea and I honestly think the roadway idea could work in the future. But that isn't the point. 

The question is why make the roads from them when you could just put them over them or next to them?

Because proposing roads that look like they're from tron brings in a ton of cash...

Ok lets talk the solar pannels then.


HOW THE FUCK ARE WE GOING TO GET ENOUGH TELLURIUM TO BUILD THIS SHIT? WE CAN'T STRIP MINE THE ENTIRE EARTH FOR SOLAR ROADS.


if that better? new material? and insight to this, solar pannels require a decent amount of tellurium, and it makes up less than 0.00001% of the earths crust, so its hard to get.

 

Yeah, i have to agree with you. The cost of a panel is pretty high. They could build a ten times bigger solar panel (not for roads). I also what will happen with rain? After all it's glass. It might be slippery or something. Also we won't be able to see the LED's under the sunlight, so there will be no road lines during the day(at least we won't be able to see them). That might be a huge problem. 

I would say astroid mining but there has to be a bigger space push first.

Sure let's talk solar panels. More specifically let's talk about anti-reflective coatings since this is the topic. Old solar cells are manufactured using tio2. The new cells you see today use silicon nitride. So this isn't a good point of contention if you are against solar whatever-it-may-be. :D

Tin is the new thing now replacing lead. So the price of the panel is gonna fall even more over the next couple of years. I dunno dude according to the people behind the road thing these things could have built in squeegee's so rain doesn't hamper their idea. Don't be surprised if they answer something similar either. :D

Building in a squeegee too? What next? A coffeemaker?

Like honestly the amount of energy you'd need to power the heater, lights, squeegee, coffeemaker, hair dryer, back scratcher and every other thing they are jamming into these panels would eat more energy than the damn thing produces.

Which is the main reason that I think the people behind this are insane.

hahaha ! The LED are very efficient but the heat panels makes me wonder a bit. If the outside temp is -20C then you need a pretty good amount of energy to heat the panels. Now take that in mind and think that the panels must do the same job in the NIGHT too! Imagine homeless people lying at the roads to warm up in the winter xD xD And of course you need the extra energy in the morning for your hot coffee.

I'm glad you brought up the energy required to heat the panels. I'll copy a calculation I made the other day about this.

It takes 330 Joules of energy to melt 1 g of ice (if it starts out at 0C, more if the ice is colder). Lets say in a snow storm (with the large snowflakes) the average mass of a snowflake is .02g. That means the energy required to melt a single snowflake is 6.6 joules. To generate 6.6 joules of energy, you would need 6.6 watts of thermal energy for 1 second. Solar Panels produce about 130 watts per meter square under peak conditions.

Lets assume that in a 1 square meter area (9 square feet, or about the size of a small coat closet) 10 snow flakes land every second in a snow storm. That means that if 100% of the electricity consumed is perfectly converted to heat (which it wouldn't be) and 100% of that heat was transferred to the snow flakes (it would be hilariously less than 100% in reality, you still have to warm up all that air), then you would need 66 watts of electricity per square meter continuously drawn to keep the road just barely thawed. And that's assuming its just below freezing outside. That is HALF the electricity that those solar panels would produce at high noon in the middle of the summer without a cloud in the sky. It would take nearly a megawatt of electricity with 100% perfect conversion per mile. If you had 50% conversion, which is still insanely high, you would just barely break even if it snowed at high noon in the middle of august and had perfectly clean panels.

If you get a heavy snow storm (around a foot), you would have to melt over 30,000 grams of ice per square meter, which would take over 10 MJ of energy, or 2.75 KW-hrs per square meter of road. If that snow falls over a period of 10 hrs (just 1 inch per hour, a blizzard can produce snow at 3 times this rate), your solar panels need to contribute 275 watts of electricity for the entire time with 100% efficiency. That is more than what they can deliver under optimal conditions. If solar panels were that efficient we would be able to power the average house in America using just 20 or 30 square meters worth of solar panels on the roof. The maximum snowfall rate that these panels could handle on their own (assuming all of the energy generated gets transferred strictly to the snowflakes) is about a half inch per hour. When you factor in how much of the thermal energy would escape into the atmosphere rather than the snow it becomes clear just how inefficient the process is. 

In the northeast, the roads would HAVE to be plowed. Every time those roads get plowed the glass gets scratched up and less light is able to find its way to the solar cells. Even if the glass holds up in a way that it is still safe to drive on, how much power will these super expensive roads produce after a few winters? Part of the claim of this project is that they will eventually pay for themselves, but they can't do that if they aren't producing electricity. They can't have put ANY thought into this claim, which makes you wonder how much thought they put into the rest of this project.

Just look how opaque the glass the glass is from where they textured it to give it suitable traction properties.

Nobody can seriously think that this sheet isn't blocking a ton of sunlight from reaching the solar cells. And this is from a nearly straight on point of view! What happens when it is scratched up from wear and tear in the mornings and evenings when incident angle of the light from the sun is shallow and even more light gets reflected? This is just one of those projects that make sense when you don't think about.

EDIT: I really shouldn't beat a dead horse, but I have another thought. As you can see from the image below I'd say at least 1/3rd of each tile is exposed PCB.

That is a ton of wasted space and would reduce the power produced per square meter by 1/3rd. Makes you wonder why they chose hexagons doesn't it? Maybe it serves some structural purpose, but I don't see anything explaining why he changed shape. His phase one prototype seems like a more ideal shape to me.

I have to go look that up just to figure out what your point is.:)~

Now that made sense.

So much good information in this post.

We get a shit ton of snow up here. Last winter was really bad and climate change is making it worse. The plows and salt destroy the roads as they are now. They'd wreck these things. Shear off those little bumps first time it went over it. Love to see stopping on slush covered glass.

Then like you said the opacity. It would get dulled very quickly not to mention the clarity of the glass you'd need in the first place. That recycled glass thing is BS. You'd never be able to make a panel out of it.

Also I'm sure like all consumer electronics there is a ton of toxic and nasty chemicals in these panels. I can't imagine it wouldn't leach into the environment.

Another thing is the time it would take to lay these things and wire them up. A road can be paved in a week with asphalt. It would take much longer with these things.

But again even if all that stuff could be fixed, why not just use regular panels and build them next to the road?

 

 

They contain lead.