That is a great idea.
Love it, lets bring Linux forward instead of talking what distro you MUST USE and such all day long.
Whenever I get into the topic of distros I suggest and say the reasons I use it and WHY.. without saying.. you must use it... :D if any of you see my past posts on the linux forums....
Meh, defensive video, don't quite agree too much, I watched the Linux Help Guy and Matthew Moore videos on this subject, and they are simply wrong in a lot of ways and frustrated about a lot of things that have nothing to do with open source software lolz, but hey, that's the way it works. The dumb thing about all of this is that the frustration of an unsatisfactory user experience on any platform (they wouldn't have even started a linux channle if they would have been totally satisfied with another platform), is projected onto open source. At least with open source, if you have the skills, you have a fair chance at achieving a higher degree of user satisfaction, that's one thing, but that is out of reach for many many users that don't have the skills. So what's the problem really? The real problem is that closed source platforms don't care enough about their users. They impose a certain use model, generic at best, and users have to swallow it or stay hungry. Open source is a way out of that, but only to those that care enough to get into it.
Another thing is that the linux community doesn't suck per se, it sucks the same as any other community on the interwebs. That's right... it's a problem of the interwebs, not of linux... the same toxicity and bullying is present in pretty much any English language forum on the interwebs, and a lot of non-English language fora are going the same route. The linux community on the internet as it is targeted in this video and the videos a quo, is not the "linux community", but it's the "internet linux community". It's a big difference. Linux was developed over the internet, and it was always characterized by strong language and pretty direct communications, that was always part of the culture, but in the first two decades of linux, it was a pretty closed community. Due to the popularity of linux with people that are getting into linux, not because of the features and technical benefits, but because of other reasons, like running away from commercial platforms due to extreme dissatisfaction, or because of the economical crisis pushing them towards free software, or because they have too much time to waste, whatever..., this has changed, and it's now a community with a lot of members that don't even participate in open source development, but expect this or that feature that isn't there, without thinking about doing something for the community. These are consumers in the modern meaning of the word. Linux as an open source community is not equipped to deal with that. It will never be. That's what companies are for, like Google, Valve, Canonical, etc... companies that base new consumer products on open source software and try to make it proprietary as much as they can to get monetary compensation for their effort. The problem with these companies, is that they often don't give back to the open source community what they've taken, and that is something they will pay a dear price for in the long run. A lot of successful companies however give to the open source community in a balanced fashion, they have a long term plan that makes sense (they've read ESR's tracts on this undoubtedly). It is however very hard to do this on a trivial consumer level. Take Ubuntu for instance, they've actually closed the main community communications channel. Why? Because they're getting nothing out of it, it's just another internet forum since a few years, where you need an industrial 10kW laser to cut through the crap. They've come to the conclusion that they're better off in a closed community. And they really are.
The haydays of the "linux community" on the internet are over. Most serious podcasts, forums, etc... have ceased or are dying. A new "linux community" on the internet has popped up, in the form of just another forum, and they've chosen linux as the target of their frustration or idolisation, but it's just venting, it's just like most other fora. Channels like Linux Help Guy or Matthew Moore are in the same category, they are but side-effects of the internet culture, and have nothing to do with linux or open source, they are internet artifacts. That doesn't mean that they're not helpful though, they offer a starting point of information. And in my opinion, that's all most fora on the internet these days can be. There are still the specialized mailing lists and small discussion groups that really matter for open source and linux development, those have always been there and will be there for a long time to come, but they are not open to the consumer public, although everyone can join, if they're serious enough and are willing to give more or at least as much as they take.
I don't know what /g/ is, I've only posted something once on even reddit and that was to report on a problem with the TS website I believe. I don't really participate in the whole internet community stuff personally, I kinda like real interaction more, I hate to drink coffee or go to lunch alone lolz. I don't see the problem that much I guess, but I do see the frustration and idolisation venting whenever I go onto the internet. Is it a bad thing? I think not to be honest. I am a strong proponent of the European right to anonymity on the internet for instance. I think that social contexts have evolved so much in the last few decades, that it's hard for people to build a social environment for themselves that they feel they can trust in real life, and I think the internet is just that, it's all smoke and mirrors, it's like everyone's private fantasy world and private custom social environment they feel they can trust. A lot of people go to a bar or café to rant against each other, that isn't that popular anymore, but now they do it on the Internet. It's the same bar talk though, it shouldn't be blown up out of proportion in my opinion.
Logan, you are such a hipster for using Ubuntu... before you know it, you'll be growing a beard and listening to metal (that was a joke)
And now I need to get back to my new linux program because I want to turn my parametric 3D printer into a 3D CNC, and I DON'T want to use different modeling software for anything, or want to rerender stuff or retweak stuff, so I'm forced to use linux and open source, because it's the only way that can be done within a really tight timeframe, so it's not because I'm a hipster... lolz
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Guys, every online community is like that. People have different opinions. In my personal experience, Gentoo and Arch are the distros that gave me the least headache and Gnome is just too stupid to get any job done; I'm a KDE kinda guy and I love rolling release distros.
Also, I don't think /g/ is representative of any community except for themselves.
Just use what's best for you, and that's it. There are over thousand distros out there and if you don't like any of them you can always make your own. I use Gentoo, Arch, Windows 7, Windows 8, FreeBSD, OpenBSD and several other distros like Manjaro, Lubuntu, etc. in virtual machines because I want to learn as much as possible about computers.
I don't think anyone, /g/ included, is trying to scare people away from Linux. It's just how people are on the internet. Take a normal person, give him anonymity and a sizable audience and you've created a cretin. It's just how it is, no need to whine about it.
P.S. Install Gentoo. And when you're done, reinstall Gentoo.
Oh, and just to add, /g/ loves Gentoo because its package manager, Portage, is the best thing ever.
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yeah, but can it play crysis?
@wendell @Logan About the new video posted also the video links to the other user. Everyone is going to want to argue that the distribution they use is the best. Some people are just smart enough to understand that different people have different needs. Saying that the distribution is better with out saying why or pointing out your use case is pointless.
<rant>Although I did say that different people have different needs. I do not believe in supporting a company that installs software that sends your file searches anywhere. Linux Mint is the like Ubuntu with out the garbage installed. Logan did install a different GUI then Unity. Steam and OBS install just as easily on it. It also has the same .deb support. That is all the software that i know Logan used.
Why I use Linux Mint. I use steam which takes a lot of work to get setup on other non-deb distributions and you have to apply more duck tap to fix it after some updates. I also have a printer that is no longer making linux drivers and it is a .deb which is a big pain to get setup on other distros.
@wendell @Logan I remember I first dove into Linux a decade ago. The thing I like about Linux is that it does as much or as little as I want it to. The other thing I like about it is that I could potential make something that benefits the community as a whole. I don't focus on which distro is better than the other or which desktop is better than the other. I find that silly. If it works for me that's all that should matter. Am I going to make mistakes, I use to when I first started and it was a good learning experience. I'm comfortable with Linux enough now to do things with it. I mainly use it to work on writing my book. Other things I do with Linux: use it as a diagnostic tool for when things go bad, attempt to use it to fix said problems, check for holes in my in home Wi-Fi, use it while I'm being a Dungeon Master (I'm retiring though) for Dungeons and Dragons, etc. I use it for a lot of different things and I enjoy every minute of it. I carry a USB with a portable version of Linux with me just in case I need to use it at work [I've used it a few times. My advice to anyone getting into Linux is simple: Use the Linux that works for you. Try each one till you find you that works for you.
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The irony is strong in your comment.
and then you go for this:
Unity has the same feature as Windows, Mac, iOS and the worst offender....Android. A rather useful online search results feature. I type in a query, I get the wikipedia article. I type in a word, I get the definition. Hell, back when Pirate Bay was first blocked it was even helping people evade it!
One flipswitch to turn it off, as it's always been.
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I'm sorry, but there's just so many problems with this video. The general tone it sets is ok, but:
- /g/ is not the Linux Community and the Linux Community is definitely not /g/.
- /g/ gives you shit for anything. I don't really know what happened, but if you post a screenshot on /g/ you are going to get shit no matter what you're using.
- If you don't understand that /g/ isn't a tech help place you should probably stop browsing it (let alone posting).
- Yes, there are elitists on /g/, but for most people, "install gentoo" or "noobuntu" are just jokes, just like pcmasterrace.
- It's not about what you get done. Really, it's not about anything except from personal preference. If I choose to install linux just to try some things out, thats just as fine as people who just stay on windows because they want to run all their legacy windows stuff and don't have the hardware to do virtualization. I'm a programmer myself, but you know, there's people who don't make money programming.
- As far as I know, you're just a tech reviewer. Did Linux actually help you accomplish things you couldn't accomplish before? Or accomplish them faster? If not, what's the point? The point is that you like it better that way. And it's perfectly fine that way. You don't need /g/'s or anyone's approval for that.
- The trolls on /g/ are just laughing so hard right now because you fell for them. They made you post a 20 minute rant on youtube about things that mean nothing.
I began dabbling with Linux almost 10 years ago with Ubuntu 5 or 6. I gave it up in college, but have come back to it a few years ago. Ubuntu is was grabbed me with it's large community, easy installation, and straight foward desktop. Since then I have flirted with Linux Mint, Fedora, OpenSuse, UbuntuStudio, etc. I use Ubuntu and work for many reasons and I now use Arch at home. I have another system with Fedora. I love Linux because I love choice and freedom. Trolls are just internet bullies. While we will likely never rid ourselves of them, we should discourage them and kill them with kindness.
Sincerely,
Your Linux Carebear!
Well said, wolfleben! Linux is what you make of it and if you can contribute back to the community then that's even better! Spread love, not hate!
pretty obvious who the people for /g/ are
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The main problem here:
"ITS DIFFERENT AND IT'S SCARY! AND I DONT LIEK EET!!!"
On both sides linux users and non-linux users
Non-Linux users are afraid of learning the new stuff because stories of constantly looking up fixes and how to make things work.
The Linux side hates each other for the different distros like you stated.
Of all the linux users I know, they do have a sense of superiority but not the level where they're assholes about it. More of "Look at the thing I did! It's AWESOME!"
Their attitude towards non-linux people is more encouraging because they always say "Well you can just dualboot and try it. If you're used to windows/Mac OS you can get [insert distro here] cause its the most like those, or if you want mine its [insert distro here]."
I personally don't use Linux because I never found a need for it other than "OOOH! Shiny UI mods! I WANTS!!" or "The OS takes less operating power now" But maybe down the line.
No I did address that but I got off on a tangent about Linus Torvalds my bad... I did mention I dont agree with the linux help guy but I could see why he may have done what he did... :D
i'm just here for the tek(oline). everything else is just minutia in a mad tek world.
My point is do you want to buy a new car with breaks that don't work. On the download page of Linux Mint you can pick to even not install proprietary codex. The program has had many bugs since its release. The program could even be a security risk if it could transfer the file and not just the name. I not even want the program installed on my computer in the first place after reading the article linked bellow.
It's like buying a car with a built in GPS and wanting to turn it off.
Ubuntu isn't missing any features, it just has one you don't want. There is no way for Unity's search function to transfer a file unless it was being mischievous (but it's open source). You can remove the package with just a command if you are that worried by it. Proprietary software isn't installed by default on Ubuntu either, you have to tell it to in the installer to install the 'Restricted Extras'.
As for security, Linux Mint doesn't even install all security updates by default so please don't preach it.
Use what works for you, don't whine about what others use. You can use Mint, it's a sleek reliable operating system.
What that doesn't give you the right to do is the exact opposite of what Wendell is saying. If Ubuntu Unity works for you, use it. If Mint works for you, use it. If OpenSUSE works for you, use it. Just don't complain when someone is using one of the others.
You can't go around calling a whole distro "garbage" and telling people to switch because you prefer a distro as it hasn't got a feature as easy to disable as the one your complaining about. That's exactly the opposite of what Wendell is saying.
You may recommend Mint but you must be reasonable when talking negatively about other distros and not just recommend your favourite as your favourite may not be for everyone.
PFFT Worst offender being android? I would say its farless offending then iCrap OS just saying.. @Kai As for linux mint they have defended themsevles quite well with the security accusation maybe you should read it.. Its funny you mention something like that since only UBUNTU devs have accused linux mint of this.. Its mostly a ploy at user base :P Though I completely agree with you on the distro stuff... I am occasionally guilty of bashing on ubuntu but for me thats all fun and games.. most people take stuff way to seriously
Like the GPS analogy
Android is made by a company that makes it's money breaking privacy law and being as invasive as possible. Google. Hence the reason I called it the 'worst offender'.
Ubuntu Devs comments on the security flaws in Mint's handling of updates where merely the first to be widely publicized but even Mint's own developers agree that if you want security over stability you should enable them.
He used an analogy that was taking out brakes, when they didn't take anything out but added something in. I kept with car analogies and went for the GPS as it is one of the few parts of the car that can be tracked.