I am building a system for my son,a teenager,so I do not want it to be something only an IYT person can keep going.That said I have an ASUS Z 77 Sabertooth board and I bought 2 X Samsung 830 128 GB drives to run in a RAID array,and WD Drive for storage,not in the RAID.I installed latest RAID drvs .duuring Fresh Win 7 64 bit install.All went well except Samsung's Software Magician,droped his wand;because does NOT recogniae the RAID array as Samsung and therefore NO Trim,update or anything.Any ideas looks like everyone else uses the SSDs in RAID with no problems.No joy from Samsung. Bret the bear
Did you set up the array before you boot into windows? Just loading the drivers won't create the array. Also, trim isn't supported when ssd's are in raid.
Well I was under the assumption that with the Intel RST versions after 11.XX on Z7X boards and WIN7 it was?The SSDs will not perform long if you can not clean them(selves) up correct?They fill up and become defragmented?And the Win 7 (64) installed but I reinstalled on a HDD because no utilities. Bret the bear
Well so much for ALL the feedback.I guess SSDs are virtually in systems all over the NET and evetually they will fill up and crap out.Recomend,recomend SSDs are BETTER than sliced bread,they just have Bullshit on the non buttered side or would the butter be the BS?Win 7 Ultimate 64bit with nothing elst takes 50+ GBs not much room for anything else ,,unless you spring for the 1/2 TB editions?Right? Bret the exasperated bear
defrag dosent effect ssd's the same as normal hardrives im pretty sure you dont get a drop in performance i mean you cant even defrag a ssd. the reason being that it can access the info equally quick regardless of where the fragmented data is stored however with a hdd having it fragmented means that the reading head on the hdd needs to move around alot making access times slower also making it go back and forth unnecessarily which can also effect the lifespann of your traditional hdd.
well thats how it is im pretty sure, i need to discover what trim is just my brain aint good at storing info =/ so learning alot is what i need to do. anway hope this helps.
You don't have much experience with SSDs do you? Intel SRT is completely different from RAID. When you set up Intel SRT you're making your SSD a cache for your hard drive. All of your most used applications will be saved to the SSD, while the rest of your programs will be saved to your hard drive. Intel SRT will also only work with 64GB of SSD space. ASUS motherboards will support more than that with the software they provide with the board. I'm not exactly sure, but I believe TRIM is still supported with SRT.
RAID 0 on the other hand won't support TRIM at all when it comes to SSDs. You will lose some performance over time, but it will still be light years faster than a single SSD or HDD. In order to setup RAID, you're going to have to set it up in the RAID controller. There should be a screen that pops up while you're computer is booting before Windows starts, which asks you to press a certain key combination to set up a RAID array. You can set the array up through there, then you have to load the RAID drivers for your motherboard while you're setting up Windows after that, so the OS will be able to recognize it.
SSDs do support TRIM when they are not in a RAID array.
Uhm vortex could you tell me if my knowledge was correct about ssd defrag? i wanna know just to see if im correct.
Please. =[)
Yeah, you're right. You don't have to defragment an SSD because there are no moving parts. Defragmenting a hard drive will help with performance because a hard drive actually has to go find the data on the disk using moving parts. If pieces of the same program are on different parts of a hard drive's platter or platters, then it's going to take longer for the read arm to find the data, where if all the pieces of a program are in the same location, you'll be able to access that program much faster because the hard drive doesn't have to work nearly as hard or long to find the data. SSD's don't run into this issue because they don't have any moving parts and don't need a read arm to actually read and write data.
yay. thanks man my little pool of info was right. learned that at my it apprenticeship i know alot about hdd RAID and the different types. i have an ssd but cba getting even more info about that at the moment. =P
anyway tyvm vortex.
No problem. What's your apprenticiship for? Everything I've learned has just come from being interested in the subject over a number of years and looking it up. I'm starting to think I should have done either computer science, computer programming, or computer engineering in college though, lol.
yeah im a hardware engineer aprentice. im 19 i just got into it cuz i was 18 at the time but il either be getting a job with the comapny im at or il be going to uni to do computer sience/engineering. sadly i dont meddle with solely pc hardware i do EPOS systems. upsides are i learnt the whole cisco package (starting in november) and various other things i cant remember.
also i love hardware thats why i applied to the programm however never thought of learn all the technicalities.
also i live in scotland and a pc gamer / hardware enthusiast is truly a rare breed here we have virtualy no hardware stores only the online services i have hunted through this land high and low. =[) england have some whcih i envy -.-"
Well most tech stores seem to be online these days, but there are a couple of places in the US. Tiger Direct, Micro Center, and Fry's Electronics to name a few. You generally always find the best deals online though.
Well,to answer your statement'You dont have much experience with SSDs' ,I do not.But I got my 2 X Samsung 830 128 GBs in a RAID 0,I installed OS,guess you should see I can not know TRim doesn't work and Magician,Samsung's Software does not recognize or work unless I built the ARRAY and installed the Win 7 64 bit OS.My issue was that the drives after a few days were very sluggish and Magician DID not see them.I just went ahead and put the new OS on a HDD.No problems now with speed getting slower ,but now I have 2 SSDs that really I do not know what to do with.If you read enough on the Net you soon realize there is no concrete answer to what I was experiencing.I like the speed ,no moving parts but I can only see them not performing over the long haul very efficently.And you are wrong to think that they do not need to be ordered.Things are written to BLOCKS and parts removed and so forth,and to think they can read just as well without some house keeping is false.Garbage colllection,Trim,etc are there to do a neccessary service,correct?I thought about using the drives in other ways I am just dissapoinred that I believed all these RAID 0 systems work as they should. bear
If you want trim then don't run them in RAID. It's that simple. Even if trim is there for a reason, you're still not supposed to defrag an ssd.
Btw, iI have no idea what magician is in the first place, but it's definitely not necessary in order to install or boot to an OS.
Vortex88,well Magician is just Samsungs proprietary software.Well,I think it will only run on Samsung.So,I have learned more,my whole goal is trying to find out why and how,or I do not appreciate the education and I am just taught and regergitate.All my woes and many others ,as well,come from the lack of an updated Intel driver.That is what runs most of my SATA's.It is out 11.6 or so and that supposedly now supports the cleanup of SSDs in RAID 0 (you already know but RAID 0 really is not a redundent ARRAY).Anyway now the driver is there but am I braveenought to try it?I wanted to run the 2 X 128 GB drives to get the benefits of speed and capacity in that form,and mostly to try out the SSD form factor.Will try ,again when other case modding is complete and finalizing build.Wish me luck. bear
WRONG
I actually researched this quite thouroughly. the intel z77 chipset DOES support trim in raid 0, with the latest intel drivers
defraging ssds will actually decrease their lifespan, and is completly useless. doesn't even help that much with hdds
you couldnt be more wrong about raid 0 not supported by trim...go to intels website man, it is very clear that it does on the Z77 chipset
There was talk of Intel enabling TRIM support on RAID-0 arrays as early as 2009, but given the cost of SSDs back then not many users were buying multiple to throw in an array.
The requirements for RAID-0 TRIM support are as follows:
A 7-series motherboard (6-series chipsets are unfortunately not supported).
Intel's Rapid Storage Technology (RST) for RAID driver version 11.0 or greater (11.2 is the current release)
Installs the Intel® Rapid Storage Technology (RAID) driver version 11.2.0.1006 for Intel® Desktop Boards.
This driver supports RAID 0, 1, 5 and 10. The driver should be installed after the operating system has been installed. F6 and RAID BIOS configurations need to be performed prior to installation of this driver for proper operation.
RST 11.2 supports TRIM on RAID 0 only on Intel Desktop Boards with the 7 Series chipsets.
do us a favor and know your shit before giving advice!