I know, I know...kind of a weird thread for this forum, especially when there are the official Beth forums and Nexus forums, but, I wanted to ask around the community I am familiar with first before stepping out into the great beyond.
So really, the short of what I am about to ask is: Is anyone is familiar with modding TES Oblivion?
Things aren't quite as smooth as modding Skyrim. It's been YEARS since I last played and modded Oblivion. Back then I use to be quite good as troubleshooting problems, but now...not so much.
I got the usual required utilities like Wrye Bash, OBMM, and LOOT - plus TES4LODGen that is necessary for the Unique Landscape mods and View Everything (whatever it's called. RAEVWD) and obviously OBSE.
The problem I seem to be running into is the game crashing after the menus. I can't start a new game nor load an existing one, but I can navigate the main menu without any problems.
Wrye Bash nor LOOT are throwing me any conflict errors with mods, and it can't be a missing masters error as that would crash the game immediately at launch.
I had a stable load order, but after installing a couple of OBSE plugins (and then deciding I didn't want them) is the point when my game started crashing. I've tried restoring those plugins, but it doesn't seem to be fixing the problem.
So, am I missing any other important utility for organizing and cleaning my Oblivion directories? Or do you guys have any troubleshooting ideas to help me track down the source of the crash? Right now I'm just sort of shooting blindly in the dark.
I've tried disabling all ESPs and ESMs except for the necessary Oblivion.esm and the DLC esps/esms and that didn't seem to fix the crash.
I've tried having Oblivion regenerate it's INI file - that didn't fix it.
I'll post my LO in the post below, in case you might suspect it's an esp conflict.
Active Mod Files:
00 Oblivion.esm
01 Beautiful People 2ch-Ed.esm
02 x117race.esm
03 Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm [Version 1.40]
04 Cobl Main.esm [Version 1.72]
05 Better Cities Resources.esm [Version 6.0.7]
06 All Natural Base.esm [Version 1.36]
07 Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp [Version 3.5.5]
08 DLCShiveringIsles.esp
09 Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp [Version 1.5.9]
0A DLCBattlehornCastle.esp
0B DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.12]
0C DLCThievesDen.esp
0D DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.15]
0E DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch - SSSB.esp [Version 1.0.14]
0F DLCMehrunesRazor.esp
10 DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.7]
11 DLCVileLair.esp
12 DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.11]
13 DLCHorseArmor.esp
14 DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.9]
15 DLCOrrery.esp
16 DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.7]
17 DLCSpellTomes.esp
++ DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.1]
18 DLCFrostcrag.esp
19 DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.10]
1A Knights.esp
1B Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.1.8]
1C Beautiful People 2ch-Ed MS Elves - NoSc.esp
1D Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp [Version 1.40]
1E Better Cities .esp [Version 6.0.5]
1F Cobl Silent Equip Misc.esp [Version 01]
20 Unique Landscapes.esp [Version Dummy]
21 All Natural - Real Lights.esp [Version 1.36]
22 Better Cities Full.esp [Version 6.0.7]
23 xulRiverEthe.esp [Version 1.0.3]
24 xulTheEasternPeaks.esp [Version 1.2.1]
25 P1DkeyChain.esp [Version 5.00]
++ Symphony of Violence.esp
++ Beautiful People 2ch-Ed Merged Hair Modules.esp
++ Beautiful People 2ch-Ed Disable BandBlindMask.esp
++ Beautiful People 2ch-Ed Merged Eye Modules.esp
26 xulCloudtopMountains.esp [Version 1.0.4]
27 xulAncientYews.esp [Version 1.4.5]
28 Better Imperial City.esp [Version 6.0.7]
29 xulBravilBarrowfields.esp [Version 1.3.6]
2A xulLushWoodlands.esp [Version 1.3.5]
2B OOOExtended.esp
2C OOOShiveringIsles.esp
2D xulCheydinhalFalls.esp [Version 1.0.1]
2E xulSilverfishRiverValley.esp [Version 1.0.5]
2F xulBlackwoodForest.esp [Version 1.1.2]
30 xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp [Version 1.6.6]
31 xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp [Version 1.2.2]
32 xulChorrolHinterland-BC6.esp [Version 1.2.5]
33 xulArriusCreek.esp [Version 1.1.5]
34 xulSnowdale.esp [Version 1.0.7]
35 xulAncientRedwoods.esp [Version 1.6]
36 xulJerallGlacier.esp [Version 1.0.2]
37 Sounds of Cyrodiil.esp [Version 1.1]
38 Oblivion XP.esp
39 xulEntiusGorge.esp [Version 1.2.2]
3A xulCliffsOfAnvil.esp [Version 1.1.3]
3B xulBrenaRiverRavine.esp [Version 1.1.2]
3C xulTheHeath.esp [Version 1.1.1]
3D xuldarkforest.esp [Version 1.0.5]
3E xulAspenWood.esp [Version 1.0.4]
3F Oblivion_Character_Overhaul.esp [Version 2.0]
40 xulFallenleafEverglade.esp [Version 1.3.2]
41 All Natural.esp [Version 1.36]
42 Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul - Unofficial Patch.esp
43 xulSkingradOutskirts.esp [Version 1.0.3]
44 xulImperialIsle.esp [Version 1.6.9]
** All Natural - Indoor Weather Filter For Mods.esp [Version 1.36]
++ Beautiful People 2ch-Ed CustomRace.esp
++ Beautiful People 2ch-Ed Vanilla Race.esp
45 RAEVWD New Sheoth.esp [Version 1.7]
46 Better Cities - Leyawiin Flooded.esp [Version 6.0.0]
** Beautiful People 2ch-Ed Sheogorath Eye.esp
++ Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul - Knights of Nine.esp
++ Cobl Tweaks.esp [Version 1.44]
47 Better Cities - IC Imperial Isle.esp [Version 6.0.2]
48 xulRollingHills_EV.esp [Version 1.3.3]
49 xulStendarrValley.esp [Version 1.2.2]
4A xulPantherRiver.esp
4B Better Cities - Unique Landscape Skingrad Outskirts.esp [Version 1.5]
4C Better Cities - Unique Landscape Barrowfields.esp [Version 1.5]
4D Cobl Glue.esp [Version 1.72]
** Grass Overhaul.esp
4E Better Cities - Unique Landscape Cheydinhal Falls.esp [Version 1.5]
4F Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp [Version 3.08]
50 RAEVWD Cities.esp [Version 1.9]
51 Immersive Interiors.esp [Version 0.8.1]
52 Better Cities Chorrol - Knights of the Nine.esp [Version 6.0.7]
53 xulPatch_AY_AC.esp [Version 1.2]
54 Better Cities - Unique Landscape Snowdale.esp [Version 1.6a]
55 RAEVWD Imperial City.esp [Version 1.9]
56 3 Alternative Stories.esp [Version 1.2]
++ Specialanims.esp
57 Better Cities - VWD of the IC.esp [Version 6.0.0]
58 Better Bell Sounds.esp
59 ElzMoreVoice.esp
5A ElzMoreVoice - Original Voice Replacer.esp
5B Better Cities IC Waterfront - Unique Landscape Imperial Isle.esp [Version 1.5]
++ Enhanced Water v2.0 HD - SI Addon.esp [Version 0.1]
5C Better Cities Bravil - Unique Landscape Panther River patch.esp [Version 1.5]
5D WindowLightingSystem.esp
5E All Natural - SI.esp [Version 1.36]
5F Cobl Si.esp [Version 1.63]
60 All Natural Real Lights - Better Cities IC Patch.esp
61 Enhanced Water v2.0 HD.esp
++ Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul - No Daedric Items.esp
** OOOExtendedArcheryPatch.esp
** EVE_KnightsoftheNine.esp
++ EVE_KhajiitFix.esp
62 EVE_ShiveringIslesEasterEggs.esp
** EVE_StockEquipmentReplacer for OOO.esp
** EVE_StockEquipmentReplacer.esp
** OOOSIArcheryPatch.esp
63 Elz - Realistic Gravity.esp
64 kuerteeAutoFirstThirdPersonView.esp
65 OblivionReloaded.esp
66 Bashed Patch, 0.esp
Try setting up Mod Organizer (yes from the Skyrim nexus)
It uses its own ini files and mod lists based on user defined profiles while keeping your Oblivion folder separate from your mods.
Here is a guide on migrating your nmm install over to it. Mod Organizer 's only issue with Oblivion is that it doesn't support the auto detect feature included in some scripted installers.
Yeah, so I have read on a few of the threads on different mod pages, which is why I have been using Wrye Bash and OBMM to install mods rather than NMM or MO.
Still, I'm sort of at wits end with this crash, so I'll take a look - at the very least, maybe it can give me a few different avenues to check for where the problem is coming from.
Its not that big of a problem really, especially considering that your load order is not massive at the moment. Of course eventually it can get overwhelming if you end up 150+ mods.
Edit: After looking at your load order, I see a sound overhaul along with a weather mod (At least it looks that way)
I remember that mods changing ambient sounds wouldn't work well with weather mods in Skyrim, but I can't confirm its the same for Oblivion. Might be worth testing.
Oh, I know.
But the ol' Oblivion Engine's handling of mods is...not exactly the intuitive.
I think it might have been 4 years ago - maybe 3, I don't know. I was in the mood to pop Oblivion in and play around a little. At that time I had quite an extensive LO and eventually it corrupted my save.
This time around, I really just wanted to get some essentials in there...honestly, I've been thinking about cutting out the animation mods I have in there as well. Not only does my internet not really allow downloading at lot of mods (trust me, I spent the past 2 days downloading this LO - right now MO is downloading...with 7 minutes remaining...) but I think I would be more comfortable playing with just a smaller LO....ironically for the sake of less crashes and conflicts.
Edit:
per your edit:
I'll take a look. I think I had those 2 together because the weather mod actually recommended putting the 2 together.
Having a long load order doesn't mean you'll crash a lot. I've had a nearly 300 mods (with merge patches) all working fine without any extreme crashes. As long as you clean the mods with TesXedit and use Loot ( Also follow load order placement recommendations from mod authors) while making sure the mods conflict as little as possible you'll probably be alright. If you're willing to put a bunch of effort into it, you can get a stable game (sans the case that you have a bunch of mods that constantly run scripts in the backround).
Also, just in case you're quicksaving often; the game doesn't handle save overwriting well and causes your save to become corrupted over time. The safest way to save is to manually create a new save every time or open the console with ~ and type "save savename"). Quicksaves and autosaves should be avoided unless you can be bothered to delete them after you don't need them.
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Yeah, I'll keep that in mind.
The only save I have, at the moment, is a test save I built to check to make sure mods were playing nice and functioning as intended, as well as a chance to make adjustments to the Oblivion Reloaded shaders.
and...like I said...it was stable at a point....and now it's not. But it's not just the save file, either. I cannot start a new game.
Mod organizer didn't help? If all else fails try deleting the game folder and validating it through steam. Since Mod Organizer will keep the mods (unless you installed it into your Oblivion folder and delete it) you won't need to set everything up again.
edit: Is LOOT organizing your master files like that?
I would think that the official dlcs along with their patches would be placed before the other esms.
Yeah, MO didn't really give me anything new. Had I original set everything up through MO, it might have had a few other options as it discusses in the "Conflict Resolution" section, but otherwise, as things stand, it really didn't tell me anything I didn't already know.
As for the LO - yes, this is the way LOOT has organized it...
I'm not one to judge, if LOOT says this is correct, then...okay...
but ever since I switched to LOOT instead of BOSS I feel like LOOT's changes aren't as substantial and don't always feel right. But if BOSS isn't being supported any more then I guess LOOT is the only automatic LO organizing tool...
Technically LOOT is BOSS AFAIK; It was just renamed after a major update. Personal load order edits can be better if you know what your doing, I'd move all the master files related to the dlcs above the other masters just to see if anything changes.
If MO didn't fix it then your ini files can't be the problem, that narrows the problem down a bit more I suppose.
You could go through the tedious process of enabling each mod one by one to find the culprit, but you did mention that you messed with some OBSE plugins. I would temporarily delete all the files belonging to OBSE from your data folder and disable all mods that need it, then try to launch the game. If you can make a new save then that would tell you that something went wrong with OBSE and/or a mod that uses OBSE. Then you could reinstall OBSE and test each mod that requires OBSE individually.
Before doing the tedious process, I'll start small and stick with disabling OBSE and all related plugins...still tracking down which ones do what might take some time...guess I better go brew a cup of coffee.
the things I go through just to play a video game...
change of plans...I don't even know where to begin with this...and I need to get it all under one mod organizing tool, and since it seems MO has a lot of conflict detection stuff built in, I guess I should just....
sigh
wipe and start again...
I'll look over my downloaded mods and see which ones I think are necessary and which I can go without, remove the ones I can go without, wipe my Oblivion, and try from the beginning again.
Man, this is one thing I DON'T miss from the days of Oblivion...I just kind of wish Skyrim could provide the RPG character building experience Oblivion has...
Yea, its a shame that Bethesda has diverted from traditional RPG mechanics lately. Skyrim does have a few mods available that make the player progression system like Oblivions, but its not exact, for one they don't effect NPCs.
Mods that make Skyrim a bit more like Oblivion/Morrowind, just in case.
Ancient Spells 2 -adds spells from the previous games.
Immersive Questing - Makes journal entries similar to Morrowinds.
Character Creation Overhaul -Basically Oblivion's character system.
Disparity -Alternative to CCO
Pauldrons -Pauldrons.
Spell Crafting -Oblivion like spell crafting
Spell Research -More complex spell crafting mod
Morrowloot Ultimate -Makes loot more exciting.
Reflection- adds back the messages you get after leveling up.
Skyblivion May intrest you as well. AFAIK they're pretty close to completion.
Skyblivion stuff
I love Skyrim, I really do, but it's just such a shame that such a great RPG game strays from the classic RPG styles. The reason I installed Oblivion is because...well I really don't have many games that are close to a classic RPG style. I have 3: Oblivion, Fallout NV, and Divinity Original Sin...but I just wrapped up a 60 hour play through of FO4, so I decided not to do NV, and as much as I loved Divinity, I...I don't know, it's world isn't appealing to me at the moment (also, as petty of a complaint as it sounds: I think it's character creation system is a bit lack luster) So I decided to go with Oblivion.
I don't know, my internet is acting especially slow today and watching the download time tick into a day or more's length to download a 5gb game...I think Oblivion is just a lost cause.
I still have Enderal for Skyrim installed, I never actually finished it. It's not quite the classic RPG sense I was looking for, but it's closer than vanilla, so I guess it will have to do.
As for the mods;
Okay, I wrote up a whole section about Character Creation Overhaul thinking it was something entirely different, well that was embaressing. I'm glad I double checked that link! Wow, it sounds pretty great! Almost makes me want to build a new LO for Skyrim...but those download times...I want to move back to the developed world with normal internet speeds cry
I've been keeping up with Skywind, I knew about Skyblivion but thought it was in it's very very early stages...didn't think I would even see it until the next ES game came out, hahaha. Well, if they are close, then I am eager to see the results!
I think I saw an article the other day on RPS that they had the world built and completed and were filling out the quests now. So in that regard, I think Skywind is closer...maybe?
I'm okay with either one, though I spent more time in oblivion than I did in Morrowind, so for nostalgia reasons I would, of course, like to see oblivion.
Skywind seems closer to completion than Skyblivion when you first look at them, but Skywind is actually much further behind due to Skywind having to have everything redone (Morrowind's assets were too ugly). Skyblivion only needs everything ported over from Oblivion and Navmeshing, along with the custom UI and whatever needs to be done in papyrus. Skyblivon basically a port (like Morrowblivion) while Skywind is almost entirely created from scratch.
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