Mechanical Keyboard Dilemma

So as a bit of a pre-word, I originally asked this question on the LinusTechTips Forum.

I'll cut down some of the wordiness of my other post from that site and just simplify it down to a list and which one I'm thinking of going with...

So here are the keyboards I'm looking at.

  1. Logitech G610 (MX Browns, White LED)
  2. Cooler Master CMStorm QuickFire Ultimate (MX Browns, White LED)
  3. Logitech G710+

Originally I was going to go with a Corsair Strafe RGB with the MX Browns, but I decided that I can save a little bit of money and get something just as good for less...

I'm leaning towards the G610, but I want some more input. I haven't found anything that says the G610 has any build quality issues or other QC issues. It just lacks a Wrist rest which the G710+ and Strafe RGB have but that's not like a big deal if I don't have one, and anyways there are probably better third party wrist rest than the ones that are included.

(Warning! I wrote much more than I was expecting to)

What is it that you're looking for in a keyboard? Mech keyboards are probably the only piece of hardware I follow. I've got a horrible habit of collecting them (I actually need to sell some, but I'll get to that one day)

Whenever somebody asks me about which keyboard to buy, I frequently recommend the GH60 or KC60 if you're unable to find the original. As it happens, the KC60 is up on Massdrop right now, and it's being sold at a very reasonable price. I recommend it so often because it's more customizable than any other keyboard. You can swap the firmware for TMK if you like, the switches can be replaced without soldering (if you get the non-LED version), you can add more layers than you could use on the board, and it's compact and cheap.

The biggest feature of the GH60/KC60 is something you just don't find on other boards. You can change the layout to practically any layout imaginable. I'm not talking about changing the keycaps, I'm talking about changing the location of the switches. Want to add a split-shift on both the right and left sides of the board? No problem! Want to split your backspace key into two separate keys? Easy! Want to change the bottom row to winkeyless spacing? Sounds good! It's an incredible feature, and it's why I bought the board in the first place. There are very few boards that have this feature, even today. The few boards that do have taken inspiration from the original GH60.

Those are the pros to the board, but keep in mind that it's something you'll need to get used to.

The cons would be the size. It's not a con for me, and it doesn't lose any functionality, but it's certainly something that takes a week or so to get comfortable with. Using the arrow keys or numpad is no different than typing a capital letter (eg; Fn+W/A/S/D for arrows), and you can change those settings to whatever you like. I keep either esc, ctrl, or Fn on my Caps Lock key, and use SpaceFN for my main function layer. With that functionality, it makes the switch from a full-size no more difficult than learning to type a capital letter (Shift+X).

If you're not looking for a full-sized board, the CM Storm (Coolermaster) and Quickfire Rapid are both very popular TKL boards. The Quickfire Rapid can be hacked with the Frosty Flake controller, which is actually pretty neat. The guys over at 1upkeyboards sell them, and from what I understand, they turn your QFR into a fully programmable mech, so you can load TMK and do whatever you want with the thing.

I prefer recommending smaller companies, though. There's a great up-and-comer right now called the Clueboard. It's custom built (and pretty inexpensive) as you order it. You have control over much of the board as you select the parts used, but you are forced to use their layout. it's an interesting layout, and I've been meaning to get my hands on one, but I'm broke! Anyway, I wanted to throw them in for good measure.

There are lots of other boards coming to mind, but I feel like I've been ranting long enough. Basically, try and go for a board that allows you to load TMK. Fully programmable boards are absolutely worth the effort, and they'll certainly last.

Oh, and my last suggestion would be to make your own board! It's getting cheaper and cheaper to throw a teensy into a home-made (or ordered from a laser-cutting service) acrylic case & plate, you can even order laser cut aluminum. You don't need to design a PCB, you can hand-wire the board, and you can load TMK for full functionality. It's a fun project, but probably not for everybody.

Let me know if you have any questions, I'm quite the novice when it comes to gaming hardware and all that jazz, but I'd like to think I know my keyboards.

Edit: Bad grammar. Still getting used to this text-box format.

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Oh, and I didn't say anything about the boards you've listed. Be careful, as each of them has a non-standard bottom row, meaning it will be a serious pain in the ass to replace the keycaps.

When looking at keyboards, look for something with a 1.25-1.25-1.25-6.25-1.25-1.25-1.25-1.25 bottom row. You're going to want to buy some cool keycaps at some point. It's part of the allure of owning a mechanical board. Even if you don't want to change the aesthetic, one of your caps may break, and you'll be stuck trying to find a difficult-to-find key (in which case, you normally end up using something that's too small or angled improperly).

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The wordiness didn't bother me... From the pictures I found in the Google search of the CH60 and KC60, they're so small...
I understand buying something from a smaller company or a start up it's like buying your groceries or other stuff at a local brick and motar/mom and pop shop. I'm mostly after aesthetic so that's why I was originally considering the Strafe RGB with MX Browns. Then decided to save a little money by going with the Logitech G610 or something else that has MX Browns and White LEDs.

I wouldn't mind building my own mechanical keyboard that could be maybe a side project I do a little bit down the road.

The non standard key caps should be too huge of a problem... If I really wanted to customize my keycaps why not do something with 3D printing, Though I'm not sure if there'd be a way to let the LEDs shine through the key caps if I were to replace them.
Or if a key cap breaks there might be some way to get a replacement key that's the right size and angled properly.

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There are 3d printed caps, the problem is trying to get the right tolerance for the cherry stem. They're a bit smaller than they seem if you're looking at pictures online. The times I've tried to print caps, they usually snap at the stem, or they feel too uncomfortable to type on. I've probably spent ~$800 on keycaps over the last few years, but most people involved in the hobby spend much more. If I had to buy caps for non-standard boards, however, it'd be maybe 1200-1300 (assuming those keysets had right keys for the layout). I haven't checked on those keyboards extensively, but at least make sure you're using a 6.25u spacebar. Avoid anything with a 6.5u spacebar like the plague, you just can't find replacements for them.

If you do end up going with one of the non-standard boards, you'll want to look at DSA caps, as they're the easiest to fit for non-standard layouts. Granite is a popular option, and Pimpmykeyboard has a custom DSA set that should fit those layouts.

I understand the uneasiness with the smaller boards, it took me a while to open up to the idea of a 60% keyboard. I can say that my GH60 is the only board I use now, but if you want to look at something else, check out winkeyless b.87 and b.pad. The b.pad is a separate numpad that can be used as an arrow cluster and numpad, and the b.87 is a fullsize board (and they look damn good). I think they even make a b.87 in TKL now, but don't quote me on that. If you want to go with something more a major manufacturer, both the quickfire rapid and the novatouch are pretty popular. The novatouch is a Topre board, though, which is an acquired taste (constant arguments over whether or not it's a real mech).

Check out /r/MechanicalKeyboards for inspiration. People constantly post their custom and modded boards, and you'll find group-buys before they sell out. I stopped following them a while after I started using the GH60, but I'm willing to bet they're still a great resource.

Is the reason the printed caps tend to snap because of the filament/plastic used? Or have you used PET, ABS, etc. and they all snapped?

I think part of the reason I don't want a smaller board is because sometimes the number key is useful. Like doing alt codes...

Like I said, I'm after MX Browns with White LEDs (RGB is fine too) though I suppose no LEDs are fine as well. It's just that backlighting is kinda nice and something that I had on my old MacBook Pro that I kinda miss the most.

Anyways thank you...

I think I'll probably just stick with the G610. Maybe if I build a keyboard I'll do it with Blue switches. Maybe if I felt like trying my hand at woodworking again I could make the case with some kinda wood though wood and plastic might be weird. Though maybe I could just get like typewriter keys or something that were modified for the Cherry MX stem That'd look a little better than wood with plastic caps.

I don't know what I'd use the second keyboard for. I guess as a back up if the Logitech decided to crap out or if I wanted a keyboard to pair with a laptop I suppose that'd be an option.

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Haha, once you get into mechs, you start buying them up like crazy. I'm sure you'll end up getting another in the future.

And no worries man, get what's functional for you. I feel the same way about needing the numpad at work, and it was the part of the GH60 that took longest to get used to. The b.87 full-size is pretty damn stellar: http://i0.wp.com/winkeyless.kr/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/B_87_EX_0656.jpg
Das Keyboards also makes a popular full-size, and it has the same features as the G610 http://uncrate.com/p/2014/04/das-keyboard-4-ultimate.jpg

The G610 looks pretty neat though. I bet you'll end up enjoying it. I couldn't imagine somebody trying out a mech and going back to a chiclet board. I guess just look around at keycaps first. It looks like a 5.75u spacebar, and I'm not sure how common those are. Also worth checking massdrop to see if they've had any sales for that board, and posting in /r/mechmarket to see if anybody has one they're willing to sell. You can usually buy a board for around 1/2 - 2/3 the retail price by buying aftermarket on the enthusiast forums.


I ordered some 3d-printed caps from Shapeways, so I think it was ABS filament. I'd be willing to bet that resin printing might work (can't remember the name of the print method, but it involves curing resin with a DLP projector). When I tried it, the first key snapped when I was trying to put it on, I filed the rest down and the majority ended up worn down before I had the chance to replace the first broken cap. It's interesting for Artisan caps, but it seems difficult to do for your alphas/mods. There was a guy who made a pretty neat 3-d printed custom board, complete with 3d keycaps. I'll see if I can find a link to it. When it comes to 3d printing caps, he'd probably be able to give much better answers than I can.

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Ducky make some great keyboards, with backlit browns




and you can get keycaps

All prices are in AUD so ignore those

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Firstly @ydrinkcoke yeah, I've only used membrane and scissor switch keyboards. I went to a Best Buy that had a couple keyboards with MX Red, Romer G and Razer Green(?) switches... (The Keyboard that I wasn't sure about the switch was a Razer Blackwidow Chroma.)
I liked the Romer G and Razer switch, the MX Reds weren't bad but I wanted something more like the Romer G and Razer Green so I felt that maybe an MX Brown might be decent.

Second and lastly @Vandal85, I heard a lot of people like Ducky and Filco keyboards.
What makes those two (or at least Ducky) stand out the most?

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Exceptional build quality, standardised key cap sizes (easy to get custom caps), no useless crap like usb ports or audio passthrough so no inflated cost. Very durable, easy to clean, nice thin cable.

Having said all that, if possible, try before you buy!

The other option you have if you want backlit browns is a WASD code keyboard. You pay more - but you can get custom keycaps done at the time

http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/code-keyboard.html

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Couldn't agree more with @Vandal85, Filco and Ducky are both highly regarded manufacturers and make great quality boards. They're known to last, easy to customize, and aren't insanely overpriced. IIRC, Ducky boards seem like they're a bit pricey (it's been a while), but they back it up with quality. I might be wrong about that, but I vaguely remember some high priced boards from them - I might be thinking of those Duck custom Korean boards though.

I can say that pretty much everybody who's owned a Ducky swears by it. I'd say they changed RGB/LED lighting in the keyboard community. Same thing with Filco. They make a board called the Majestouch and practically every enthusiast owns either a QFR or a Majestouch. You really can't go wrong with them.

(Practically) every keyset will work with it since it has a standard layout, and they're built to last, absolute tanks.

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I have 4 Ducky keyboards and I can say that the build quality on all 4 boards are so strong, I have a prediction a single blow to someone's head could render them dead. Quality is still top as of today, for 4 4-year old keyboards. They are the 9008S2, with one being the TKL Year of the Dragon Edition.

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@ydrinkcoke cool
@Vandal85 interesting, maybe I'll have to see if Micro Center would possibly carry those boards and have them on display
@Destroyed007 cool always wanted a keyboard that could double as a weapon /s

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I personally opt for Cooler Master, the quality is really on another level. Love both my Quickfire XT and TK.

I think the aesthetic of the QuickFire Ultimate was something I wasn't too keen on, it was just in the price range I wanted and it didn't look hideous but the G610 looks better and is in about the same price range.

Just picked up a Cooler Master TK Cherry MX Brown it is way better then the Kailh Browns in Thermaltake Poseidon Z.
Back lighting and just the way the keys feel is better. The biggest difference is sound the TK is way more quiet then the Z.

i have the Poseidon Z with Kailh blues and i love it. coming from a dell stiff membrane to this thing is incredible.i want a ducky with MX black for my next keyboard.

The Poseidon Z is a good keyboard 10x better then rubber dome keyboard of any kind. I would have kept if except for one problems it has a menu key where the windows key is on the TK and i kept pressing it and having a menu pop up. The key works the same ways as a right click on the mouse. When the windows lock key was depressed it was still active. Hard to type when a menu keeps popping up. Mech keyboards from what I could find in my research seem to be each person types different and there is most likely a Mech keyboard out there that you will like over some other Mech keyboard. It is good you like the Z and the blue keys. For me the blues make to much noise browns make a lot less noise then the blues and these browns on the TK make less noise then the browns on the Z. Thats why It would great to be able to rent a Mech keyboard from all the brands and be able to find the perfect size and key type that fits the best.
Congrats on your purchase
Have a day

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@RissViss and @looming-hawk I plan on going withe G610 in MX Browns...

If you are going to get a mech keyboard make sure you have a return system in case it is not what you want.
I went to best buy gave one a try then I went to my local pc parts place ( the best service in winnipeg ) and got the exact keyboard I wanted.
Once you have a mech you like wow its like having an ssd vs hd do you need an ssd no but you have to fight me for it to take from me lol.