I don't understand why people use non-socket 2011 intell

Why would someone use intell but not use socket 2011? If they will use socket 1150, why wouldn't they just use AMD? A 8350 is between a 4670k and a 4770k, but the price difference makes it plain stupid to get a 4770k. Also, the 8350 is faster than the 4670k and costs less. The fact is, anyone getting a 4670k or below is a dumb fanboy. So, if it is between a 4770k and an 8350, the 4770k will be faster, but is it really so much faster that it's worth $200+ extra? I don't think so.

Now, socket 2011 is much faster than AMD, so for an extremely expensive build, it is surely worth going 2011.

Can someone explain why people get socket 1150 builds? For me, it is either AM3+ or 2011, 1150 is never even considered.

Lazy programmers? Or just bad programming in general?

Really in this day and age there is no excuse to continue to develop single threaded programs, unless someone can explain to me why a single threaded program is better than multi?

I don't understand that either, FX8350 gives about 95% of the raw performance (much less on per core IPC, but that is mainly an issue on legacy applications that are poorly threaded and probably do not really need it) for about half the price. If you actually needed that 5% more (i.e your using it for your profession, a 5% increase in productivity is a 5% increase in your income) then you would go all the way, you would probably get a 4930K or higher and overclock it right?

I find it funny, you often see fanboys go out and spend most of their budget on a really expensive CPU relative to performance like a 4670K or a 4770K, then they end up with something ridiculous like 750ti, or they buy a 760 and play their games on low... They may as well be playing on a console.

"I don't understand why people can't spend £300 on a processor then a further £150 on a motherboard"

People don't use 2011 because they don't need to. They're extremely specialized processors that have no place outside of workstations. That, and you have to pay out the ass for them. Hell, for the cost of a 2011 chip and motherboard can get you a somewhat powerful rig.

 

4670k is a superior processor to the FX-8350, but that is to be expected. In newer games such as Battlefield 4, there is very little of a gap in performance, I've seen many benchmarks,in some the 4670k takes the lead, others the 8350 does.

 

"The fact is, anyone getting a 4670k or lower is a dumb fanboy"

No. They're actually intelligent. They realise that  the 4670k performs similarly in all tasks that can use upto 6 cores. But completely wreck every AMD processor in single threaded tasks. For some people who live near a Micro-centre, the cost difference is negligible.

 

>Inb4 Intel fanboy

AMD powered gaming rig at home.

I have a 4770k and GX760 and the FPS here are fine on full settings and everything at 1920x1200 in all the nice games.

I'll admit I'd have got the i5 equivalent (or another 2500k) had I not been into 3D and video work.

 

In the end I think the GTX760 is a stonking card for the cash. Why would you need more unless you ran 1440p or many screens?

In my experience GPUs depreciate far harder than CPU values too. A good CPU might last you longer than your GPU will.

+1

@OP The 8350 is a good processor, but I wouldn't say that anyone who uses an i5 or such is a dumb fanboy.  I was able to get my i5 3570k for $150 on Ebay.  It has been running strong since February.  So it was actually cheaper for me to get Intel.  If AMD would have been cheaper at the time, then I would have bought that instead.

A 2011 system is too expensive for most users, not only in absolute terms, but also in terms of general economy. Most users don't need CPUs that cost more than 100 USD. Even for gaming, an i3 or Athlon or APU is more than enough. With higher end parts come higher end peripherals, cooling, motherboards with heavier power assemblies, etc... most of that is just a waste of money. I do agree that the Intel 1150-offering is ambiguous, in that it blocks a lot of highly necessary functions like hardware virtualization.

That's what makes the AMD platform attractive: AMD doesn't have the ambition to sell high end stuff, not in their CPUs, not in their GPUs, not in their embedded solutions, they aspire to bring full-featured, stable, affordable hardware, and for instance require motherboard manufacturers to support all the chipset features in their products, whereas with Intel, motherboard manufacturers can block chipset features. AMD also doesn't invest in high performance GPU card development, they just leave that to the GPU card manufacturers, and they don't limit the range of performance optimisation the GPU OEMs can do, whereas nVidia does.

Since AMD is not a US controlled company anymore, but depend on ATIC for the most part of their hardware and technology decisions, they have really come a long way and have stepped out of Intel's shadow. They have adopted the "Volkswagen Golf" business model, and it's working quite well for them. Even an FX 9590 is sold a a lower price than an intel i7-4770k, and both require about the same price range of motherboard and cooling solution to work at maximum potential.

Intel fanboys are those that buy an i7-4770k to run it on a cheaper motherboard and with a cheaper cooling solution... result: the CPU autothrottles down to the performance level of an i5-4300M, the system can't do hardware virtualization which means no gaming without infecting the hardware with Microsoft malware, etc... so a lot of money being thrown away, and for the same money, even by sticking with Intel CPUs, a much better system could have been bought, for instance with an i5-4670 (non-k), which shares the "sweet spot" of performance per buck for an entire system with the AMD FX-6300/6350 for instance. Both work with less expensive motherboards, are less expensive to buy in the first place, deliver more than enough performance for most users, and leave place in the budget for hardware that really improves the system performance, like for instance a good SSD and a stronger GPU.

People that need a stronger CPU than an i5-4670 (non-k) or AMD FX-6300/6350, should consider an Intel X79-based system, but many of those users, should really be looking at C226-systems or other real workstation and server boards. The X79-systems and AMD FX-8/9000 series systems cater for a very specific category of users. The general market for 1150- or FM2/AM3-systems with less cores, is much larger, the strange thing is that many users buy the least balanced configurations within that range, but hey, that's how Intel makes its money, and that's why Intel can get away with blocking vital functionality in it's most expensive 1150-products...

I'm confused.

I bought a 4770k and renderings in Mental Ray are about 3x faster than my 2500k at the same clock speeds.

It's a good bang per buck CPU to me.

 

I think some people over-analyse things when they don't need to be analysed that far.

Fine if you are making gaming machines to sell for a profit and buyers will gauge just on benchmarks to do their buying. Fine if you are running a render farm, or crunching data in server racks.

But someone just buying and making a gaming machine?

Does it really matter if they 'waste' a whopping £100 more than they might need to have done under benchmark XYZ in UVW resolution with ABC graphics card.

 

Intel are blocking vital functionality I don't even know is missing on my 4770k, so you have to spend more money to do the tasks you want to do.

That is how the world goes round. If they didn't do that then my 4770k would have to cost me more money, to cover their lost revenue from people no longer buying more expensive chips to do those jobs. 

Dave

 

The fact is, anyone getting a 4670k or below is a dumb fanboy

 Making such uneducated, immature statements isnt what the tek community is about.

"I bought a 4770k and renderings in Mental Ray are about 3x faster than my 2500k at the same clock speeds."

clock speed=/=Performance. Well, not anymore at least. Now it's down to the architecture, though my knowledge in CPU/GPU architecture is lacking, so I'm not able to say anymore than that it's the architecture making a difference

 

£100 is a fair amount of money to a lot of people. Money can always be better spent elsewhere, so putting more than you need to into a gaming rig is silly,but people still do, all because of the term "Future Proofing", oh how I hate this term.."I'll spend $4k on a computer so I don't have to upgrade for a long time!", 1 year passes "Oh no!, this piece is outdated now!, Best get the newest one...Oops. It's incompatible with <x>, best buy a new one as well, just to stay future proof!"..and before you know it, there goes another $4k.

Value for money is very important in rigs because of this. If you put that extra £50 into a GPU, it may get another 800 points in firestrike(using it as example for performance gaps(I think?)), and be able to play at higher settings for a bit longer before it starts to feel its age.

2011 is by no means value for money, simply because they are made to do one task, and people buy them to do this one task, no matter the cost. So workstations is where they belong. Nowhere else.

i7s, if you have the money to get one, fine. But if you're only gaming, an i5 will even beat an i7 sometimes.

i5's are great processors. They really are. Nothing more to say.

FX 9*** have no place in this world, they were more of a "Screw you Intel, we can do these OC's in factory and not burst into flames!"

FX 83** are great for budget rendering rigs. Even beat some i7's in some places, and for a damn sight less as well. Though in gaming they can sometimes lag behind the i5s.

FX 63** are amazing. If you're on a >$500 budget for a gaming rig, these processors are perfect. Best value for money on the market by far.

A bit of a side track I know. Not sure why either. Just going with the flow.

The 4770k was faster than the cheaper Sandybridge extreme chips when it was released. Since then the new Ivybridge extreme chips have been released, and the 4770k is still competitive with the lower priced 2011 CPUs. Every day tasks and normal desktop use doesn't really take advantage of the premium 2011 chips.

I personally spent the additional money on a 4770k to get a nice rounded CPU that was capable of gaming and high productivity. The reason I didn't consider AMD in this latest build of mine is because the FX chips aren't suitable for all games. Sure, many newer games like BF4 take advantage of those CPUs, which is absolutely fantastic. But my favourite games (typically strategy games like Total War), and many older games that I play work best on Intel.

Enthusiasts are always going to spend the premium if it makes a tangible difference. I will agree that they are not the best price to performance parts. 2011 is far worse in terms of price to performance if you're largely gaming. When my friend gets severe dips in game on his FX chip, and I don't, it is extremely satisfying.

I got a 3770k last year for 230$ at microcenter, at the time it was worth it.

I'm on 1150 platform because it's the best on mobility/performance ratio scale.

no love for 1944... or hate, i don't think anyone even knows amd makes workstation chips

Stating that one brand or socket type is superior to another, without justifying the context is just subjective speculation and not useful in any way. 

"The FX-8350 is between the 4670k and 4770k..." In what way? Based on what? "Also, the FX-8350 is faster than the 4670k..." again, same questions. 

The truth and fact of the matter is; there is no "best CPU" or socket that is superior to all in every way shape and form. Your choice of CPU should be determined by usage and budget. Is it for gaming, editing, browsing, bitcoin mining, overclocking? What can you afford? And do you plan to upgrade down the road?

There is no single socket that's right for everyone. If I had to choose one socket for all, considering value and performance per dollar, it certainly wouldn't be 2011.

 

He wasn't arguing against the 760, he was arguing against the 4770k.

Right now, a very common setup for pure gaming is a 3570k and 650/650ti/660, driving a 1080p monitor. Even with Arma 3, arguably the most single core CPU-demanding game out there, the 3570k has a lot of CPU resources going unused. Paired with a mid-range GPU, a 3570k is not really a useful upgrade over even a 4300k from AMD, and those are only 90 bucks, let alone an 8320 for 150-ish.

The reason that a CPU tends to last longer than a GPU seems to be that people are way overspending on CPUs to begin with, myself included.

Some of you would be horrified at my main rig, it runs an 'ancient' Xeon 5650 socket 1366, and until 6 months ago it was running a W3550 the former being a 6 core 2.66, 12 thread cpu and the latter being basicaly an i7 950, both at stock, in an ISV certified Dell Precision, which spent the first two years of its life doing Video editing and photo work.

I will 'upgrade' to an X5680 when prices come down, if I build a workstation round SKT 2011, it would bankrupt me.  I've got OCZ REvo Drive, a Highpoint Rocket  Sata 3 card and two OCZ Vertex 4's too, I reckon most people would find it quick enough in 2013.

I can play games on it too as it has a 7850 PCS+, BF4 runs very well on 8.1

If I sold it, I could probably only get enough to buy an APU AMD system, although they do, do Fire APU's..

http://www.amd.com/uk/products/workstation/graphics/ati-firepro-3d/APU/Pages/APU.aspx

 

The fact that Intel are constantly pushing the 'latest is greatest' train out, gives geeks an inferiority complex about running an old socket or the last gen CPU. Even if they don't need it, many will buy.

 

 

4670k - $209

8350 - $199

Oh yes, that's much more expensive. That extra ten dollars makes me a total fan boy. You're so right. 

And the 4670K and 8350 trade blows. Even on multi threaded apps, the difference is negligible. 

I think I just broke your logic, OP.

Plus, there's the fact that the AM3 boards themselves are (for the most part) very low quality. And good luck using one for an HTPC with a small motherboard, that doesnt really exist. 

And the power consumption. I'll have fun on my 0.3v when not at 100% usage.

I find it funny, you often see fanboys go out and spend most of their budget on a really expensive CPU relative to performance like a 4670K

You mean the ten extra dollars? Did you even look at prices before posting this? No, of course not.

Also, the z87 chipset destroys the 990 chipset of AM3 boards.

I went 8350 for 2 reasons.

1. I believe most new games will take advantage of 8 cores.

2. I got a good gigabyte mobo for free.

The second one is more important really. If i had a 1150 socket mobo i would be a  I7. But the  8350 just made more sense in my situation. If an I7 would be better for you and you have the money, go for it. The 8350 is great, the I7 is great. I wouldn't go I5 anymore for a heavy gaming system anymore though. With the new 8 core consoles, it will pay to have an 8 core system in the long run.