A little while ago UbuntuBSD was created. It combines the BSD kernel with the Ubuntu user land ( is using the word user land correct?). And it was created with the focus to escape systemd. A refugee focused distro to be home to those who are familiar with Linux but want to rid themselves of the all seeing and logging eye of systemd.
Now the UbuntuBSD project wants to be apart of the Ubuntu Community by becoming an official Ubuntu Partner.
UbuntuBSD, is different from Ubuntu of course from the use of a different kernel, but mainly its different by the init system. It does not use systemd. Instead it uses the same init system as freebsd. And if more users come to use UbuntuBSD because of the fact that their is no systemd, and UbuntuBSD becomes an official Ubuntu Partner, do you think that users will beg the Ubuntu guys to drop sysd? Or will UbuntuBSD be home to just a few "refugees" who liked Linux like it was back in the old days.
The amount of distro's that do not use systemd are far and few in between. Busybox is now mostly used by embedded distributions. So if Ubuntu were to switch back to Busybox or maybe to another init system, they would be going across the grain. And maybe some would say, that they are "going back in time".
Of course no flaming and such. Every one has their own opinion. And opinions that you do not believe in is not going to kill someone. Be fair, nice and respectful while posting.
No, despite the noise of the Systemd haters I think it, and its descendents are here to stay. UbuntuBSD will or wont stand on its own merits, there are several other advantages to using a BSD over Linux and it will probably find its home with those who want FreeBSD with the simplicity of Ubuntu.
I can't imagine Ubuntu going back in time and dumping systemd, it's just too awesome. I do however hope you can get together and maintain your init version so you still have options.
systemd doesn't follow the KISS concept - "Keep it simple, stupid". Therefore a lot of people hate it since they think it doesn't fit into the Linux software world. It is monolithic, not modular and does a lot of logging in the background. Some people are afraid that systemd is becoming something like a local version of Facebook on your computer - always present, always logging etc. I personally think, that systemd is different than most initialization software from the past. And I think, that's the whole point of free software: You can do anything you want and share it with others. If others like it, they can use it, look into it, change it and redistribute the software with and without their changes. If systemd starts doing really stupid things, it will be changed or replaced. By now Ubuntu and other distros are doing great, by giving it a fair chance to show what it can do and judge it based on gathered experience instead of silly hating. Here is some really good video that shows how people (especially in the open source community) should look at works of other people:
Also UbuntuBSD won't have any real impact. Driver support, especially for graphics cards, simply doesn't exist for BSD. Therefore they would need to map Linux on top of BSD. It would have been better to mod an existing distro. Changing the kernel is pointless, since Systemd is not part of the Kernel but an application in user space.
Well as long as we can see the code inside systemd then I don't see a problem yet. I have watched the Linux sucks video before and I don't like that guy. He is too arrogant for what he does. Also only fraction of the video contains any useful information. The rest is him talking about his childhood and life experience which i don't care about.
That's why I pointed directly to the relevant systemd part. Anyway. My point is: yes, Systemd is not a problem. It is more that some people are looking at it from a quite religious perspective. They doom Systemd since it is not part of their religion from their perspective. It's like Christians dooming gay Christians - they are different, let's hate them.
Honestly the last time I really used init for anythig was when I was learning linux in kernel 2.26. Maybe a little before 2.26... Anyways systemD is 10x better in my opinion. Shit isn't scattered between var usr/share and local. Its all in one app with the loggers keeping track of what starts and what fucks up, as they should.
Lets say you want to learn arch, yeah? Get a disc, slap it in, pacstrap -i that shit and there, now chrooted and in there and you think your display manager works with wayland. Reboot, nothing. You can however get to tty and use irc to go to the arch linux channel. In the non systemD world you would be running around for a half our between .r .h and .gcv files in 3 or 4 separate base system directories unless you pulled an app from github that put all that shit in one file. Then you're spending an hour looking through 1800 lines of text like a dirty gentoo user trying to find the color red so you can tell the people on irc who have completely forgotten about you what broke.
In systemD you open journalctl and just hit pageup for five seconds to se what the issue was.
Honestly I would like all the confusion back just a little bit because there was more and more to learn from it but it was also a huge pain in the ass to deal with. I see no problems with systemD.
Just as long as systemD office suite doesn't come out ;P
A while ago when I was hearing about this whole Systemd hating stuff for the first time I did some research and found some random forum where people started complaining about almost everything Systemd does. Some people especially complained about the logging and that this could be used by Canonical to collect user data and sell it to Amazon. I don't know real good arguments why Systemd should be a bad thing. Most of the complains are more "religious" fanaticism than legit arguments. That logging stuff is a fraction of that bullshit. I really don't care. I use Systemd and as long as no one can show up with real arguments against it, I simply don't care.
Then those people have never opened systemd and looked at it. Open a terminal right now and do sudo journalctl and tell me how amazon could use any of that.
Did it. Lulz. :D I don't know who at Amazon would buy it, but maybe I should just put all that stuff into text files with 1000 lines per file and try to sell them on Amazon... such business model... so wow :D
Yeah the paranoia is a little retarded to be honest. Its like judging gta v when all you have played is bibleman for your entire life. You have no clue what you are talking about until you actually look at the fucking thing.
I don't know what all the systemd hate is all about either. People often say it tries to do too many things at once but I think it still does its job quite well
I agree this idea that the logging is bad is completely preposterous.. To sys admins this data is absolutley important and paramount to solving issues and watching system activity over time and diagnosing long standing. Issues along with looking at access logs. I really don't see how systemd is that bad. Sure it adds a bunch of icing on the cake but the icing is tasty and sweet.. No reason to get rid of it to be honest it's quite superior to sysinit
That being said @FaunCB@Ohban learn to argue without derailing it with cuss words a puns and jabs like that's what she said. Its something I notice on here all to frequently is that when someone can't be convinced instead of simple discussion it kinda blows up hahah.. ✋ try to keep discussion on point with the original topic. I think we have a sound linux community here and if linux communities could stand against the annoying hate we could probably discourage it enough that it becomes a minimal thing
Linux has to evolve to meet modern demands. Just like any other OS. It does not mean people give up their freedoms for something lesser. It just means something new and possibly slightly more invasive comes around to meet the needs. System D is part of Linux's evolution people would be good to help the project
I guess, you didn't get the whole point. @FaunCB and I didn't argue against each other. There was nothing offensive in one of our posts. Also don't consider things like "fucking thing" as cuss words. It's fairly normal to say such things in modern English - especially on the internet. We have problems with cuss words and hate speech, yes. But that's noticeable by anyone and not a problem on this forum for the most part. Look at other forums when you are looking for such things. The arch community is one of the worst examples. The Kernel mailing list is another one. We should avoid ground breaking insults since they are just totally pointless. But trying to teach people how to write since one person used the word "fuck" and the other one made a short joke about something, is too much. The Linux community and the Open Source community consist of humans. Humans have different behaviour, vocabulary, create, like and dislike different things. Anyway, I removed my "that's what she said" post. I just want to point out again: It was a simple joke and no insult. @FaunCB understood that. You should try to read more carefully before drawing wrong conclusions. With that said: Peace for the community!
I heard SystemD will soon have its own software center too! ;) In all seriousness, I totally agree that yes there is a lot of logging going on, but in reality, it's very well put together and simple to check the logs if you're really stressing about it. And I agree with the video @Ohban linked. Remember watching it a few months ago.