AMD Based Server / Workstation Queries for a Build

I want to build a workstation/server with capability to learn (used broadly here) the following:

Budget: CAD 2500 (a bit of wiggle room but pretty much max keeping in mind the impending recession)

Requirements (no particular order. would be nice to have all satisfied):

  1. Build an all-in-one server/workstation, separate from main desktop, which can be accessed remotely from other computers if need be.
  2. Virtualisation (learn multi-node Networking as a result)
  3. AI (used broadly here but starting from A and going to Z [potentially, but at least get good grasp on concepts])
  4. System should support DDR4 ECC (ideally). Pros/Cons? (Apart from more $'s)
  5. Intel / others 10Gbe-Tbase ports
  6. Learn security (might do CCSP or a similar certification at some point)
  7. System has to be air-cooled and ideally as quiet as possible.
  • Why AMD and not Intel?

Per my understanding there isnt really much distinction between AMD server class and consumer class (apart from differences between Threadripper and Ryzen). This makes is cost-effective True? If not, please share your knowledge.

Additional Queries:

  • Is Ryzen 5950X + appropriate motherboard capable of ECC. (Have bought 64 GB Crucial DDR4 2133 MT/s (PC4-2133) CL15 DR x4 ECC Registered DIMM 288-Pin Server Memory CT2K16G4RFD4213]

  • What is a good GPU for AI related workloads/learning?

  • Would a 1000 watt Seasonic Titanium PSU be sufficient for a system like this?

  • Would Noctua based aircooling solution suffice for a systme like this?

I’d recommend taking a close look at the EPYC 3000 series SoC. I’m aware of 2 manufacturers offering boards: Gigabyte and Asrock Rack.

I’m actually in the process of purchasing the Gigabyte MJ11-EC0 (link) which will cost me around 500 euro (say CAD 650-ish). It’ll do what I want (essentially a NAS) but it rather limited in terms of external connectivity (no 10Gb LAN, single PCIe slot) But it’s a small board that fits pretty much anywhere.

On the opposite side of the spectrum I found the Asrock Rack EPYC3451D4U-2L2T2O8R (link) More connectivity overall (dual PCIe slots, dual 10Gb NIC, etc) and a slightly bigger board that’ll still fit in most cases. But I also found a 2k USD price tag on Newegg recently for that board :roll_eyes:

There are other options: I recently purchased a Asrock Rack X470D4U (link) and paired it with a Ryzen 7 1700 (non-X) and 2x 16GB non-ECC RAM sticks. Neat system, although the thread for it is rather long :wink: Most notable nuisance is the distance between the CPU socket and the nearest RAM slot, which influences the choice of cooler you can use. I’ve solved it by not populating these slots, for now, but also a smaller cooler for older AMD systems (IIRC mine is for AM3 CPU’s, doesn’t really matter) For a 5950X, I’d recommend the X570 board Asrock Rack offers, the X470 board may struggle power-wise.

  • All Ryzen CPU’s are ECC capable, but not officially supported. YMMV!

  • Look at the nVidia professional cards, like the A400 or similar. probably not the cheapest solution!

  • A 100W PSU is overkill, unless you include more then a single GPU to the system, 750-850W suffices on a single GPU but for a no-GPU system 400-500W is plenty, even with a full HDD RAID6.

  • Noctua has very capable fans and undoubtedly equally capable coolers, but don’t underestimate the AMD stock coolers. Having said that, your choice of cooler depends as much on the case you’re building in as the performance/heat production of the CPU and optional GPU(s).

HTH!

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If this is home lab I think Ryzen is generally enough; I use it myself. In my case a 5900x with 64 GB and about 6 TB of ssd. It’s not that long ago that my production servers were similar spec; 12 cores and half the clock speed!

The money saved by sticking with the ryzen platform can be used for more/faster storage.

Your budget will build a kick ass ryzen setup but I think you’ll be a little limited with Epyc or threadripper at that level of spend which would compromise the budget you have for GPU and storage (and case, PSU, etc.)

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A couple more thoughts

  • 10G is overkill for home unless you have a high speed storage server to access via it, or many clients hitting the box (and at home that’s a no :joy:). If you want to play with cheap 10G hardware go nuts but it isn’t essential for your lab. If you’re running all the stuff on your lab workstation you can use virtual networking and an instance of pfsense or similar as a VM for virtual networking instead. Routers and switches can also be virtualised: GNS3 and the recent dell layer 3 switches can be simulated for free.
  • you definitely want to go all in on SSD (preferably high speed) for live storage on this box. Rust is fine for archive but it’s pretty useless for VM hosting these days.
  • 128G of ram might be something you want in future as budget allows. Don’t be too worried about having to drop Ram speed to use 4 dual rank DIMMs. Sure you won’t win any benchmarks but even running 2133 you’ll still have a do it all (inc competent gaming) box.

As above epyc would be nice but I think given your budget you’re better off putting the money you have available into more SSD, more core count per dollar and more RAM than you’d manage with a similarly priced epyc.

Good luck!

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For Ryzen you’ll have to be careful about board selection. Many boards can accept ECC DIMMs but will not actually enable ECC. ASRock is known for enabling it, and their ASRock Rack division makes server-oriented boards, like the ones @Dutch_Master mentioned (here’s the X570 thread). I believe a couple of ASUS boards support it as well (but not all). MSI is notable for not enabling it, despite claiming “support”.

There are ongoing discussions about lack of error reporting to the OS for various boards and BIOS revisions. The ECC may still function and restart the system in the case of an uncorrectable fault, but you may not be able to tell that it’s correcting any faults beforehand.

AMD’s official stance is that they do not disable ECC on Ryzen, but also do not qualify it, so it’s up to the board manufacturers to do what they wish.

Server boards are more likely to have 10G onboard, support for IPMI remote management, and an on-board VGA graphics controller so you don’t need to use the GPU for an otherwise-headless host OS. They’ll also be more expensive.

In terms of base capabilities at this end of the scale, not a lot of difference. There are differences among the platforms though, such as…

These two components are mutually exclusive. The consumer (Ryzen) memory controllers only accept Unbuffered DIMMs, which these are not. The server (EPYC) memory controllers are the opposite and do not accept unbuffered, but would be happy with these Registered DIMMs.

(Workstation Threadripper Pro supports both types, but at this point pretty much everything on that platform is outside your budget.)

On the EPYC side, I would probably not recommend the 3000 embedded line; it’s Zen 1 and limited in compute power compared to both Ryzen and full-blown EPYC, and you’ve mentioned wanting to play with some potentially compute-heavy tasks. Instead consider Rome (Zen 2), a 7282 would get you something a bit more comparable with Ryzen 5950X, but optimized for parallel tasks instead of single-focus desktop tasks. If this + board takes your budget in a direction you don’t like, then stay Ryzen.

Which brings up the broader differences here. Ryzen is optimized for compute power, particularly focused tasks like you’d see on a desktop. EPYC is optimized for parallel I/O; it can’t do a single task as fast as the equivalent Ryzen, but it can do many things without bottlenecking each one.

Quiet aircooling is definitely achievable, if that’s the concern. One thing I would note here is that chassis selection may be relatively important, depending on hardware choices - many of the server-class boards assume front-to-back airflow as if in a rack. You can get that in a lot of chassis styles, it doesn’t mean you have to go rackmount, it’s just something to pay attention to. A chassis that’s designed more like a clearly directional wind tunnel is likely to be better at quietly evacuating heat.

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For the OP’s budget i’d seriously look at the cost difference betwen 5950X and 5900X.

I went through the same scenario recently (building my home lab, upgrading from 2700X) and unless you’re very much an edge case you’ll likely run out of RAM and then storage before CPU in a home lab (depending on what you’re doing) - and the difference in benchmark performance between a 5900 and 5950 is nowhere near the price difference. I’d use the money saved for more storage or maybe some real network gear if you’re into the network side.

My work VM lab (for testing updates, multi-site AD, domain trust setup, switch/router sim) is still an i7-6700 with 64GB of RAM and SSD.

The barrier for that machine is mostly still RAM (and then CPU - i’ve added a heap of SSD to it).

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